There are many sports people that become after-dinner speakers and tell entertaining stories about their life as a sports person. What sets Billy Moore apart, is that his success in the sporting arena has been transferred into the business world. He’s an entertaining and thoughtful larrikin full of contrasts, with the depth of a serious message and a life story that is bound to make you laugh. I hope you enjoy our fascinating chat on this week’s Small Talk Big Ideas podcast.

About Billy Moore

Billy Moore is best known as a Rugby League Legend, playing 211 NRL games for North Sydney and 17 appearances for QLD in State of Origin. His name is synonymous with the passionate “Queenslander, Queenslander” call.

His post Rugby League career has seen Billy develop into a highly polished motivational  speaker, special guest at Corporate functions and brand ambassador for some of Australia’s leading companies. But it wasn’t a smooth path to success.

Twenty years ago, he battled the dual pressures of a collapsed business investment and a marriage breakdown. Broke and divorced, the former NRL, Queensland and Australia star had sunk to a devastating low. But he eventually emerged wiser, more optimistic, and with a new sense of perspective revealed through dark times.

Announcer (00:00:03):

Thanks for joining us for the small talk, big ideas podcast, a podcast to enrich yourself where we have conversations with inspiring people about all things, property, business, and life. And now the host of small talk, big ideas Ian Ugarte

Ian Ugarte (00:00:24):

Welcome to the small talk big ideas podcast. Today I bring along one of my amazing mates, William Moore. You may know him as Billy Moore, especially if you’re from Queensland and New South Wales. He has been a significant challenger to the way that the Queensland State of Origin call was brought out.

Ian Ugarte (00:00:41):

If you ever wondered where the term Queenslander came from, listen to Billy Moore’s version of events of how it actually came out. But more importantly, Billy Moore who made it to the top grade of Australian rugby league was actually much more than just a rugby league player and now has actually created a formidable business. Not just in one area but in many areas and has a great influence on a number of people. Including those people out there that just want to set one goal. And that’s what he’s really good at.

Ian Ugarte (00:01:09):

Enjoy today’s podcast and subscribe and follow if you want to hear more from us.

Ian Ugarte (00:01:15):

William Moore, so long story short. I was training for my first marathon which was a New York Marathon. To get into the New York Marathon we were unsure… there was a waiting list to get in. And there was a company called Traveling Fit, that actually has some ballot to get into the New York marathon.

Ian Ugarte (00:01:35):

I was sitting there on the couch watching ABC and they had Running to America, it was a documentary by Robert de Costella, who went to the indigenous communities and pulled people out. Not because they were fit but because he thought they had the right mental state and trained them up for six months and then sent them over to New York to run the New York marathon. There was four of them I think, that first year.

Ian Ugarte (00:02:08):

I watched that documentary and I never wanted to run a marathon really, and then I thought, “Why not.” If you’re going to do it, if you’re going to do one in your life you may as well do New York. I rang them up, Traveling Fit, and they said, “Oh no, no there’s a waiting list of about 60 people. You can try next year, but this year is definitely out.”

Ian Ugarte (00:02:20):

This was probably March, early in the year. Then I kept on ringing back and I kept on ringing back every couple of weeks and it was… what’s your cousin’s name?

Billy Moore (00:02:29):


Ian Ugarte (00:02:30):

Tina would always answer the phone and it just happens that Tina that worked at Traveling Fit is related to Billy, but I didn’t know at the time, because I didn’t even know who Billy was. Well I knew who he was, but I didn’t know him personally.

Ian Ugarte (00:02:41):

Anyway I rang one day and I said, “Look whatever you could do, could you put me forward all the way up the waiting list?” And she goes, “You won’t believe it, but the last phone call that I just hung up on, he’s canceled and you’ve called me enough, do you want the spot.” And I said, “Fuck yeah, I’m in.”

Ian Ugarte (00:03:01):

I put it out there and I got it and that was 2012. We flew over 2012, but cyclone Sandy had gone through and they absolutely guaranteed, the Mayor guaranteed that the race was still going ahead. The race was on a Sunday and we were leaving on the Wednesday, I think.

Ian Ugarte (00:03:20):

Anyway, we go, fly over. Go from LA into New York, six hour flight. And I’m sitting there on the plane and my first introduction to you and Kerri was, I didn’t really see you, I saw… I’m sitting down, obviously very low in the seat and I see Kerri’s arse come past at my height. And I’m an arse person, not a boob person right, and I went, “Oh that’s a nice arse.” Anyway it turns out being your wife’s arse.

Billy Moore (00:03:52):

Actually I will confirm her bum is pretty good and when she has the marathon training it was fantastic. To our wonderful listeners, pleasure to be here I’ve worked with Ian on numerous occasions. Since that 12, what’s that eight years? We didn’t run in 12, we got canceled obviously. We went back in 14 and ran it together and then we’ve done a few runs since, it’s been a great pleasure.

Billy Moore (00:04:13):

By the way my wife beats me every time. Only once I’ve beaten her and that was with Ian by my side, it was the Sunshine Coast half marathon. When we got to the Kmarket I was feeling really, really good and I said to Kerri, “How are you feeling?” And she said, “I’m feeling terrible.” And I said, “Let’s go.” And we took off. That’s the only time I’ve ever beaten her.

Billy Moore (00:04:30):

The Billy Moore story, I’d like to take you on a little bit of a journey if I can. Tell you obviously how I ended up to be sitting right here. It combines, obviously my life in a country town in Queensland, moving my way through to playing professional rugby league to then venturing into small business, where I’ve been at the coal face for the last 20 years here on the sunshine coast.

Billy Moore (00:04:52):

I had a pub in Toowoomba as well, but obviously I am now a restaurateur and I’ve been doing that on and off for 20 years. For those that are listening that have their toes in the small business world, you’re speaking to someone who is at the coal face with you. I have sympathy, empathy and understanding of what we all go through. And the small business industry of Australia, to me is the heartbeat.

Billy Moore (00:05:18):

We’ve seen that obviously in the current climate how important small business is to the Australian economy, if not the global economy. It probably gives me a little bit of satisfaction to realize, if they didn’t, now the world can really look back and see how important we are and what all small businesses do.

Billy Moore (00:05:36):

So Billy Moore, I come from a little town called Wallangarra, which is on New South Wales, Queensland border on the New England Highway. My house is 50 meters to the Queensland side of the border. Thank God. Even though I was born in Tenterfield, New South Wales, because there’s no hospital in a town of 300 people. That’s 18 kilometers south of, I’ll say in the enemy territory. But 7th of May 1971 my mother gave birth and she assured me that while I was born in New South Wales I was rushed back across the border before the oxygen had time to infect my lungs.

Billy Moore (00:06:09):

And I grew up in this little town of 300 people. My dad was a meat worker. Unfortunately that meat work shut down in the early 80s and he was just a laborer after that, working in the orchards and the local ammunition’s base in Wallangarra.

Billy Moore (00:06:24):

My mum was a school teacher and she was probably the key driving factor in my life. Someone who really wanted the best for her four children. I was the youngest of the four. I always say I was the product of evolution, she got three wrong and I finally got it right. She was a great lady and made sure that all four of us had the best chance to have a crack at something in our lives and probably one of the three most influential people in my life.

Billy Moore (00:06:52):

I was one of those kids from a little town, like so many are, a player of all, master of none. Then when I struck 15 years of age, I loved rugby league, that was probably the thing I loved the most. When I was 15 I was lucky enough to win a scholarship to go to a rugby league camp, Armidale. University was out. And I caught my Armidale moment. One of the three major moments in my life.

Billy Moore (00:07:17):

At this camp I turned up, several hundred kids from Australia and New Zealand, and they were some of the best of the best. Australia and New Zealand school boys, they were state representative players from Queensland, New South Wales, from 17, 16, 15 and I happened to be there. I’ve come in green as green, gum leaves on the shirt. But I’ve turned up with such pride and passion and while I was so far behind the level of the other players, what I did realize is that I had the capacity to learn.

Billy Moore (00:07:54):

If anything I can convey from the Billy Moore language, I removed the word fail. First attempt in learning, that’s what fail stands for me, it’s all about learns. I went on this camp and they were so much better than me, but I realized for the first time in my life, I was this good, they were that good, but I actually got to quantify success for the first ever time in my life. For me that was a watershed moment, because I realized I had the capacity to match the best. I just had to copy it. And when you think about it from that angle, whoever invented the wheel, they got it right. But you don’t reinvent the wheel, as the saying goes, because why? It works.

Billy Moore (00:08:36):

I saw professionalism, I saw the best junior players in Australia and New Zealand and what they had I wanted. They head overseer and coach was the great Wayne Bennet. He gave a generic training program to all 700 kids, but to me it was my program. It was my program, I got this program.

Billy Moore (00:08:54):

I went back to Wallangarra and virtually trained every day.

Ian Ugarte (00:08:55):

But the thing about that too is and if we just pop up the slide I put in there, because one of your idols at the time was Wayne Pearce, he was the Australian captain wasn’t he. When Wayne Bennett, arguably the worlds best ever rugby league coach, came to you and said, “Billy I’ve prepared for you a specific training program that will get you to the next level.” You felt like that was a personally written program for you.

Billy Moore (00:09:18):

Yeah, 100%. I took charge of that program. I went back to the little town and I trained for those three years. It wasn’t until the third year, I was 17, that it all happened and I made [inaudible 00:09:26]. But do you know what’s interesting? When I came back at 15, everybody in the town, around my age group, a year older or year younger than me, there was about 20 of us. When I came back everybody jumped on the bandwagon. Everybody saw this program and I said, “It’s yours as well as it’s mine. This is our program, this is our blueprint for success.”

Billy Moore (00:09:45):

Because I told about these other kids, and I call it my Armidale moment, for that program and that ability to actually see what the best was, to copy it and then become the best was a pivotal moment in Billy Moore. And when I say the Armidale moment, it’s about seeing success and then chasing it. And the key driver on that, to actually format a real boot plan, is you’ve got to find out what Ian know that I doesn’t.

Billy Moore (00:10:10):

What do you know that I don’t? And if you’re successful and everyone out there in small business, ask yourself this question, what is the best in your industry? Who is the best, what does it look like? What does success look like, go and copy it.

Billy Moore (00:10:25):

And for me, the three questions you ask is, how you do it? Why you do it and where? Whereabouts did you get the idea to start? How do you go about doing what you do? And the key, real kicker though, is why do you do what you do? Because you spent your whole life doing what you’ve done. You’ve had massive amounts of learns on the journey and the why for you is what I want to take off you straight away.

Billy Moore (00:10:48):

If I can find out why someone is the best in the world at something. I can take all their learns, all those years of learning along the way, all those things that you might call mistakes that have shaped them and put them into my model, bigger, stronger, faster. Because that to me is the key. To get bigger, stronger, faster every day is the way, one of the key fundamentals for success. Tribally it’s called momentum. You can do that, but you’ve got to take all the learns that are in your life around you. Put them in your model and eventually it spits out a bigger, stronger, faster model.

Ian Ugarte (00:11:26):

We talk about the bottom of that triangle. We talk about everyone above you in the triangle is bigger, better, knows more than you, you can ask more information from and you get sucked up that vortex and that was your Armidale moment. All of these amazing young footballers and then you go back and you train and probably one of the most important things is that everyone dropped away as it got colder, and you turn up one day and it’s just you on your own.

Billy Moore (00:11:49):


Ian Ugarte (00:11:49):

And they’re the days that mean the most.

Billy Moore (00:11:52):

Well they do. Those days when you didn’t feel like training and the little guy on your shoulder goes, “Mate you’re fit enough, you’re good enough.” They’re the days that really made the difference. I call it the crossroads. The road to success. What we’re talking about here is how do you become the best that you can become. As an individual, as a group. As a company or a team. Whatever it is. To become the best, at some point on that journey, the road to success, you are going to come to a crossroads. A point where you can go “Oh, hang on actually I’ve a hard decision to make.” By actually going and doing it, that’s what makes a difference.

Ian Ugarte (00:12:36):

It is that, it is those days where it’s rainy, when we go jogging. Is it rainy? Is it cold? I can do it tomorrow, oh no, I’ll do it this afternoon. But it’s actually forcing yourself to get up and do that, that makes the most difference at the end of the day.

Billy Moore (00:12:39):

Well it does and you know that the key, wrapping around something really pointed right now, is in difficult times when oppositions start to falter and fall away, as they stay the same or even go backwards because the excuses are so good, to not train. As they go down, if you go up the gap here is more noticeable.

Ian Ugarte (00:12:55):

And you’ve done that before. We’ll get to that part of the story. Because that’s not the first time where you’ve gone into somewhere and you’ve come out of whatever’s going on right now and come out better, stronger when you’re ready to start again. Because from that training camp you then started to make your way up ranks.

Billy Moore (00:13:13):

I went away, as I said three years, I went away to junior rep football trials, didn’t make it and then when I was 17, I went away and I made my first representative team. And over the next 10 weeks I just kept making the next level, one after the other. And I was dumbfounded, I loved it. I bought into it. I was in my zone. I suppose it’s about taking a chance and making the most of it. And that’s what you set your life up for, it’s to be prepared for the chance. I tried in three years for this one chance and out of those 10 weeks I went from not playing representative football to playing in the Australian under 17 final at the Sydney football stadium. It was the curtain raiser to Australia versus Great Britain test in 1988. The under 17s were the leading game. 34 kids played that day, 33 were contracted, except me. I got man of the match.

Ian Ugarte (00:14:05):

So you’re the only one that goes out onto that pitch that hasn’t got a contract for the following year to play for one of the clubs?

Billy Moore (00:14:11):


Ian Ugarte (00:14:12):

You win man of the match in that game. You come off and your mother is your manager.

Billy Moore (00:14:18):

Mum’s the manager and I had four people at the gate, four scouts. Brisbane, Parramatta, Penrith and the Murray North City Bears. And they said basically, “Where have you come from?” I said, “I’ve been here you just never noticed me.”

Ian Ugarte (00:14:30):

Sorry to go back again, so you’ve got Brisbane who’s won…

Billy Moore (00:14:34):

Well they won six premierships.

Ian Ugarte (00:14:35):


Billy Moore (00:14:37):

Four premierships.

Ian Ugarte (00:14:38):

Ridiculous undergrowth base of the local area and…

Billy Moore (00:14:42):

Penrith, two premierships. You talk about undergrowth base, those three are the three largest rugby league junior bases in the world.

Ian Ugarte (00:14:50):

Your mum, your manager?

Billy Moore (00:14:51):

Yeah. She was very pragmatic. She was a school teacher, she’s sharp. Anyway she said, “Son, you’re going to play North Sydney.” And I said, “Mum, no worries I won’t argue with you.”

Billy Moore (00:15:03):

Two years later we were having a coffee and I said, “Mum why did you go to Norths?” And she said, “The real reason I sent you to Norths is I knew Norths weren’t that strong.” She said, “They had one Billy Moore. Brisbane had 30 in the pipeline. Parramatta had 25. Penrith had 20. North had one.” She said, “I had to give you the best chance, because I wasn’t quite sure how good you were.” Because six months prior I’d never played at that football. She goes,…

Ian Ugarte (00:15:27):

She’s very smart and because that is true, you know, you would have gone out and busted your jaw. North Sydney had a specific strategy having not won a premiership for so long, to go and get some big name players.

Billy Moore (00:15:40):

We then went and purchased three wonderful players. Mario “Maltese Falcon” Fenech, the late great Peter Jackson, who was a super star and another player who had a huge influence on my career, Pat Jarvis, who was a police sergeant from Newtown. Newtown in Sydney, he was a police sergeant there. Those were tough streets, it’s tough now, but back then, we’re talking, 40 years ago when he was a sergeant there, Newtown was a rough, tough area.

Billy Moore (00:16:05):

Anyway he arrested a bloke called Jeff Fenech and we know who Jeff Fenech is, if you don’t, he was the triple world champion. Jeff was told by Pat Jarvis, you either go and train in Johnny Lewis’ gym or you end up in jail. Jeff, crossroads, took the right road.

Billy Moore (00:16:21):

They bought those three players, dumped them into the young broth of players they had bubbling away on the stove and bang, instant difference.

Ian Ugarte (00:16:32):

Let’s go back a step, because you may have said it yourself, you’ve been a goal to set up from way back then. And you’ve set your goal to play first grade State of Origin, which is generally New South Wales and Queensland and for Australia. What were those goals?

Billy Moore (00:16:48):

That’s the engine. I’m talking about the road to success. Goal setting is the engine that I use. And I was just doing some this morning.

Ian Ugarte (00:16:57):

We did it just before lunch.

Billy Moore (00:16:57):

That to me is… ladies and gentlemen set goals. If you want to go to the road of success, you want to chase the dream, you’ve got to have guideposts on that road to success to get you there. But I set mine as 17 year old when I drove out of Wallangarra on the greyhound bus and what I said, I wanted to play first grade by 23. I thought I’d play for Australia by the time I was 26. And in between I’d play State of Origin.

Billy Moore (00:17:23):

I’ve turned up at North Sydney thinking that it was going to take me five or six years to get up to speed. And actually weight wise, I started, as I said, at 78 kilos, I didn’t hit my peak weight until I was 23. It just happened that the performance level didn’t mirror the weight. I was able to perform at a higher level quicker.

Billy Moore (00:17:43):

I played first grade before I turned 18. And that’s the key or one of the keys of goal setting is that you must constantly check where you are on the goals. My first big goal, huge goal, we leave Wallangarra to play first grade. Mate, to get a contract that’s a goal, but to then go and play first grade was enormous and I said, that was down the road, over the hill and round the corner on my road to success. That’s how far it was the distance. But I had these little goals to get there. And one of them was I wanted to be the best of the top six players on the field every weekend. Something tangible, something realistic. If I knew I was in the top six on the field every game, every time I put my boots on and went on the field, I’d be the top six. Then I knew I was on a real journey of getting better.

Ian Ugarte (00:18:27):

It’s a measurable.

Billy Moore (00:18:28):

It’s a measurable and you’ve got to have measurables. And they’ve got to be realistic. If you have goal posts, there’s no point in having goal posts over the hill, round the corner, because it doesn’t work. They weren’t measurable. It’s on you though to be the top six every week, when you’re around professional people, you’ve got to be at your best. And it’s not just on game day. It’s all week.

Billy Moore (00:18:49):

Excellence isn’t a some time thing. Excellence is an all time thing. You must do it all the time. If you want to be good, if you want to be the best with the best. We’ve turned up, I’ve set this goal, I’ve set the measure of playing first grade. I do it the first year in and then we added these players into the system. And we’re playing Manly at Brookvale, the last trial game of the 1991 pre season, and I had my second big moment of my life.

Billy Moore (00:19:16):

Armidale moment number one. Number two is my broken jawbone. We’re coming to the end of the game. Two minutes to go, we’re leading by about 35 points. We’ve just scored a try. We’ve come back to take the kick-off and I was the smallest of the forwards. My job was to catch it and I’d give it to the big neanderthal. They kick off, I catch it and I was going to give the ball and I thought no I’ll take it myself. I ran back into the line and I got tackled and as I fell, another bloke from Manly, Des Hasler, dived in and the top of his head hit my lower jaw. And basically my lower jaw was cracked. I had a mouth guard on the top, but obviously not on the bottom. The jaw cracked and the bone went through my face. I was laying there, heavily concussed. They took me into the changing sheds and everybody has come, as they do, and as you would always do, to console me.

Billy Moore (00:20:06):

Anyway Pat Jarvis, the last guy in the room, he walks in and he said two profound statements in my life and this is the first one. When no-one else was around, he sat down beside me looked me in the eyes and he said, “In the face of adversity there’s always some good. You’ve just got to have the courage and the want to find the good.” In the face of adversity there’s always some good. You’ve just got to have the courage and the want to go and find the good.

Billy Moore (00:20:34):

Basically, he’s saying if you’re determined enough, at the crossroads, the moment is now to show how much you want to be a success. No matter how big the adversity is, that moment, I call it my broken jaw moment. That was setting Billy Moore on a path at a higher level than I would have ever achieved before.

Ian Ugarte (00:20:55):

What were you thinking when he said that to you?

Billy Moore (00:20:56):

Piss off. I go away and I’m wired shut, because the break was bad. I had the wires through my teeth and I was wired shut for 14 weeks. In that time, Cookstown the following week. I’m out 14 weeks. Norths win 13 games. My team are winning, but I’m not playing and my number 13 jersey that I’d had got, the year before, took it off another bloke, I had that jersey. It was being worn by that guy that I took it off.

Ian Ugarte (00:21:29):

That bloke wasn’t just any other bloke.

Billy Moore (00:21:32):

That blokes a superstar. If you know rugby league, his name is Gary Larson.

Ian Ugarte (00:21:36):

So you took Gary Larson’s shirt off him at club level. Was wearing it. Broke your jaw, he got it back.

Billy Moore (00:21:41):

He got it back and on that journey, not only did he get it back he then went on and played for Queensland, 24 straight games. Superstar, played for Australia. I was good, he was great. Humility aside, that’s the reality. Super player.

Billy Moore (00:21:56):

I was so torn, because it’s my team, but I’m not doing it, I’m not winning, they’re winning without me. And Pat Jarvis was the only guy I recognized.

Billy Moore (00:22:04):

When you get the wires taken out, they cut and remove them and it takes about two weeks before they let you play again, because you’ve got to make sure everything is functioning…

Ian Ugarte (00:22:11):

And you’ve lost all muscle control too. It’s like when you break an arm all your muscles…

Billy Moore (00:22:16):

Basically we’re at a stage where I’m ready to go back playing and I was struggling. And Pat Jarvis come up and he could see that things weren’t right. And he took me aside and he said, “What’s wrong?” I said, “Mate, I’m struggling because they’re winning and that jersey is mine. I deserve that jersey. It’s mine, I deserve it.” He said, “No, no,” and this to me is a more profound statement than the first one he said, he goes, “That’s your problem.” He says, “You think you deserve that jersey.” I said, “Yeah I do.” I said “I’ve worked hard for it.” He goes, “So has Gary. Gary’s had three knee reconstructions. He’s five years older than you. He’s been working for a long time to play first grade and now he’s got that jersey.” He said, “Do you know what the key thing here is? In your life you don’t deserve anything, it’s what you make and what you take you deserve.”

Billy Moore (00:22:59):

And that I reckon is another key thing in business. As soon as you think you deserve success, you deserve an outcome, you become weaker. You don’t deserve anything in life. It’s not what you deserve it’s what you make and take every day.

Ian Ugarte (00:23:14):

If we just go to the slides. You have got… you’re playing rugby league. You become, at the time, the sixth youngest ever person playing…

Billy Moore (00:23:26):

Eighth, eighth youngest.

Ian Ugarte (00:23:27):

Eighth youngest ever to play first grade. Tell us about your first grade debut.

Billy Moore (00:23:31):

Round one of 1989, North played Balmain. I started in the over 21s. We won the game which was good, but Norths and Balmain are about similar size in the juniors area. As I come off the field I was 17 years, 10 months. They said, “I want you on the bench reserve grade, the cage for the second side.” I went, “What?” He goes, “You’re on the bench.” Anyway it got to five minutes before the end of the match and I’m think, hang on, they’re not going to put me on. Heck is this. I don’t care. I’m a reserve grade. Good Day ladies and gentlemen I’m a reserve grade.

Billy Moore (00:24:02):

Next week we played Penrith, played 21s and we win the game. Which was the first time the Norths had won for a long time against Penrith. Because as I said, massive junior base, Norths is a strength. Really. We won that and they sent us all to a field, you’re on the bench for reserve grade. Said, okay, it’s like last week, we can do it again. So I sit at the back of the box, five minutes to go, they’re not going to use me again. How good’s this ladies and gentlemen.

Ian Ugarte (00:24:28):

Because those were the days before interchange.

Billy Moore (00:24:30):

They’re not going to use me. I’m still reserve grade. I don’t care I’m going to take the field. I walk off the bench and Frank standing with four Australian coaches, the Norths and the new first grade coach. He goes “Billy, I want you on the bench for first grade.” I’ve gone, “What?” He said, “You’re on the bench for first grade.” I went, “Shit.”

Billy Moore (00:24:45):

So I sit at the back of the box. Anyway, about five to go. Maybe longer, maybe six or seven minutes to go. Norths are down about 30 nil and I’m thinking they’re not going to put me on. 30 nil down they’re not going to use me, how good is this. I’m a first grader. All of a sudden the late, great Billy Teasel, the manager, he’d been a manager for 21 years, has turned and he goes, “Go on, you’re one.” I went, “What?” “You’re on son.” I went, “Oh shit.”

Billy Moore (00:24:49):

So out I run, put the head gear on, so I take the field.

Ian Ugarte (00:25:17):

Who were you playing?

Billy Moore (00:25:17):


Ian Ugarte (00:25:19):

Who won the premiership before.

Billy Moore (00:25:21):

They’re a great side. We’ve taken the field and we’ve got the penalty, we get the ball straight back, I’ve run past the hooker and captain Tony Rea and I said, “I’ll take it up off the tap.” Which basically means, he taps the ball, gives it to me and I run straight into a set defensive line, which is a suicide run, but I wanted to.

Billy Moore (00:25:40):

Anyway I take it up, he taps it, gives it to me, I run straight between Peter Kelly, 115 kilos, Mark Guy 112 kilos. I weigh 80 kilos. Knocked me out cold. I have to this day the shortest ever debut in history, 8 seconds.

Ian Ugarte (00:25:54):

So they carried you off on a stretcher?

Billy Moore (00:25:56):

Carried me off, put me in [inaudible 00:25:57] 8 seconds. Wind it up.

Ian Ugarte (00:26:04):

Your goal was to play first grade at the age of?

Billy Moore (00:26:05):


Ian Ugarte (00:26:05):

And you did that at 17.

Billy Moore (00:26:05):

17 and 10 months.

Ian Ugarte (00:26:10):

17 and 10 months. So that means you had to reset your goals.

Billy Moore (00:26:12):


Ian Ugarte (00:26:12):

Then you do really well. You’re getting to the point of the team going well, North Sydney going well. And we can go into the story a bit more then. But you look back now and North Sydney lacked something to be able to win a premiership.

Billy Moore (00:26:32):

To me, I was at Norths, I got there in 89 and we won a premiership first year in. And I’ve come in expecting to win. I turn up at Norths and there’s this huge monkey on the back of the club, where Norths hadn’t made the grand final since 1943, I think it was, and it hadn’t really been a strong side since the early 50s.

Billy Moore (00:26:55):

I’ve found when I was at Norths is that they had a real lack of confidence. The monkey had grown so big and strong that…

PART 1 OF 4 ENDS [00:27:04]

Billy Moore (00:27:02):

The monkey had grown so big and strong that they found that, when the pressure was turned on, that it was almost an easier out, with North Sydney Bears, we’re not supposed to win. And I always take the mickey out of the club but, I was there for 11 years. I won a premiership in the Reserve Grade in year one. The next 10 years were full-time First Grade and I played in seven semi-finals series out of the 10. And one of those we came sixth, when there’re only five teams in the finals. We had the highest amount of points to ever play semi-finals, 29 points. It’s a really good time. And that year we won 17 and lost, I think it was six games and didn’t make the semis. So we were a winning club in my era. And that was a combination of eventually optimism, confidence.

Billy Moore (00:27:49):

You’ve got to have confidence in what you do. But that’s built around hard work. And the belief that, the harder you try, the more honest you are with yourself and the rest of your team, that builds internal confidence. And you’ve got to have the internal drive. It’s something that can’t be external force. To me, you’ve got to have inside yourself and your group and internal drives of success. And once you’ve got internal drive, internal pressure, then that is how success is made and perpetuated. Because it’s hard to be good, it’s so much harder to be good for a long, long time. And that’s why I played in four preliminary finals.

Ian Ugarte (00:28:25):

Preliminary final is to get into the grand finals?

Billy Moore (00:28:29):

So it’s the game before. So I played in four [inaudible 00:28:31]. Unfortunately lost the ball,

Ian Ugarte (00:28:31):

That’s four-four.

Billy Moore (00:28:33):

A dubious record to have. And we lost two of the four and extra time. And all four sides of Peter. Three to four. They beat us one. So we were there. We were close. We never quite make it.

Ian Ugarte (00:28:47):

And why do you think that is?

Billy Moore (00:28:48):

When you ask the question, that long and hard? I think yes, I think in the end, we got ourselves to a very good level. We missed that last little bit. We stopped improving when it mattered the most. When the real heat was on. And I wouldn’t put it at the blame of anybody, not one of the coaches, not of the players, but collectively as a group of people inside the organization, when we got to the real fine point, the game of all the GF, we stopped improving and we never played our best on that last big stage.

Billy Moore (00:29:21):

And that will all be forever. Because that’s a sign of true greatness is when you can deliver on the biggest stage, the biggest moment. We never did it at all. I probably didn’t play my best in those big games either. But I always said, it’s the hardest thing in [inaudible 00:29:36] league to defend is something you’ve never seen. And that’s what we were constantly improving. When you continue to improve and get better, whether it be in business or sport, whoever is your opposition, they’re trying to beat you, they’re trying to mimic you. It’s all about copying someone. They’re trying to copy you, mimic you. They’re trying to get the better of you. If you continue to develop and get bigger, stronger, faster, smarter, then you always have the other hand. Cause you’re the lead, therefore, and I think for the Bears we missed improving. We had grand finals played in July, [inaudible 00:30:08]. We patched it up and plateaued.

Ian Ugarte (00:30:15):

Tell me about you, and I know this is not our normal flow, so we’ll just work with this, you did train with [inaudible 00:30:25] in the same boxing out there as Jeff Fenech. Now, firstly, you’ve basically got one put on you and someone was embarrassed that you can fight. [laughter]

Billy Moore (00:30:36):

That’s right. Pat Jarvis comes back into the story. Another good friend of mine, Steve Roach. The year after I broke my jaw, I was at north Sydney Oval when we’re playing Balmaid and they have a good side. They play in the grand final. And so they’re on slight wane, but they still have four or five internationals and three or four hours in the forward pack, Wayne Pearce, Paul [inaudible 00:31:03], Benny Elias, Steve Rogers. So former nationals. And really, really good nationals in our team.

Billy Moore (00:31:07):

So in the middle of the game, we had this set play where the front player would run into the defensive line. The court is basically a ship, hopefully somehow break up the defensive line. Whether it be a situation where you knocked them over or put them off balance and you would create a hole and your player would run through second man-play, we call it. And that would allow opportunity. And I did that. I ran a block play for a break fly. I knocked over a big fellow, old Steve Roach. Big fellow, one of the toughest you’d ever see. And great formers run sixteens in scores. And to say Steven Roach was upset would be an understatement. He got up and assume here’s a speedball and at least a couple of scars here as well. In the eye there, that was the beneficiary of that.

Ian Ugarte (00:31:57):

And he’s much bigger than you too.

Billy Moore (00:32:04):

Yeah, he’s huge. Always excuses. He won I lost. When the punches stopped, when Pat Jarvis got involved and they had a little bit of the set-too, and then I saw the [inaudible 00:32:14] and thought he’s lucky. Like you turn up otherwise I would’ve got stuck into him. And he goes, mate you’re shooting us. You can’t find a role. He said, how about I’ll teach you how to fight? And I said, no worries. So the next day he picks me up. He’s all V-dub. We drive over the Harbor Bridge from north to south. Go into New Town to the police boys club. And I got to meet the great [inaudible 00:32:35] and a superstar and equally influential guy. [inaudible 00:32:41] I sit here having done all that was over to my football career was [inaudible 00:32:45]. I was out to become super fit.

Ian Ugarte (00:32:49):

You were really the fittest player

Billy Moore (00:32:51):

Or if not, it’ll be close to it.

Ian Ugarte (00:32:55):

And basically I had that advantage.

Billy Moore (00:32:57):

You might average good and I was able to, but basically we had them going, cause we had really limited interchange. You couldn’t go and come on off. Eventually you’d get tired and I’d get the upper hand at some point. And [inaudible 00:33:10] also itself had a really fit team. Gary Larson, Dave Fairly, Mark [inaudible 00:33:14]. The guys in the forward pack. We were at ULI supercharged fit side. So we had good internal pressure and we’ll have the standards. We all set for a job. So I’ll turn up this day at the gym. And Johnny goes, and I was doing some things like this, pugilist brag. And I said, mate come on in here. And he said, mate give me more. I want the way you play a good young kid.

Billy Moore (00:33:31):

And he said, he can’t fight, fight like sheep. Man, I’ll show you how to fight, son. Come with me walking to the juniors on a bunches few like me inside the gym. He goes, here we go. Here’s Jeff Fen, triple world champion. Jeff Harding, world champion. Is there someone else you want to meet? This guy’s bigger than those two or the triple world champion, world champion who could be better than that? And he goes, boys, is he here? He’s here. All of a sudden they have the tool. It comes back a Roach.

Ian Ugarte (00:34:06):

So there’s, I guess I’m going to just put some chops on you on the football field

Billy Moore (00:34:09):

That the day before they go on the beach, actually trains on a sand dune. And he was good. He was good, but I was like, I’ll train there. And I’ve got to see perfection in that sport. I was there with Jeff Fenech. Good at inspiring is Jeff. One little story, but I also got to see Costa Zu.

Ian Ugarte (00:34:29):

Wow. What a fighter he was too.

Billy Moore (00:34:31):

Two of the greatest fighters of all time. But under Johnny Lewis, what was the raw honesty?

Ian Ugarte (00:34:37):

But that continued too because when you’re super fit, you turn up, your trainer used to be hard to turn up first grade training. Now it’s easy. You get picked for Queensland. Malcolm reckons you’d look better in a blue shirt, so you get picked for Queensland. And that pace, form.

Billy Moore (00:34:58):

Yeah. Well I did actually the tire there. I actually was a joint Louis’ gym. So Norse played Balmain on the Sunday. I actually got man of the match, but we lost the game.

Ian Ugarte (00:35:10):

And that’s an unusual thing. You don’t usually give man of the match to the losing side.

Billy Moore (00:35:14):

And so the next day we didn’t train quite as much back then. So we’re talking 1992. So I just show you about training the joint loss. So I did my 18 rounds and joining as a client because Queensland got beat for the week before in a game. One of the ’92 series. Because my new routine is playing for Queensland. I said aw, but I went back to my house that was living at opposite [inaudible 00:35:39] club. And my mom of all happened to be there. She never came to see me. I think she was there twice over the course of my career, she took the phone call from the Queensland slick.

Billy Moore (00:35:49):

The house had this that Paul had been chosen to play for Queensland. I mean, opening up the door to the house, like my mom’s just running. She’s jumped and the corner, over my arms and over the most vivid moments in my life. I will never forget. And the great thing was she came, that was 1992, game 2. Two was more the boot. She saw that game as my only game, she saw me play because she had a massive stroke the following year. It was funny. Cause I scored in the first 10 minutes of the debut game and she was sitting aside my two brothers and she gets very vocal, very carried away. Very, very biased, my mum. She always wants to say all the time, And goes, my son just scored, my son just scored. And that was 10 minutes into my career. And I thought, how is this? The next 16 games and 70 minutes, I never got any of the timeline, but it was great that mum was there.

Ian Ugarte (00:36:41):

But the pace. The pace is unrelenting.

Billy Moore (00:36:54):

When people go into probably when people start doing what we’re doing here, you’ve got this pace of subdivisions. And I’ve got to get this through council. I don’t know who to talk to. And you’re not actually seeing things quite clearly. It’s not just a big fuzzy model. And you just feel lucky grabbing at straws.

Billy Moore (00:37:05):

A hundred percent. When I took that side,

Ian Ugarte (00:37:08):

I’ve never heard of that part of your mum. No

Billy Moore (00:37:12):

I get emotional too. I think about it. I’ve told her that many times. And it’s said for her to be there at that game was very special for me. But for her take a phone call. Because I was 20 years old when that happened just before my 21st birthday. So my mum had been on that journey the whole way

Ian Ugarte (00:37:28):

And he was supposed to play first grade at 23.

Billy Moore (00:37:29):

And you’re playing for Queensland at 21.

Billy Moore (00:37:31):

Yeah. So to me, it was my experience, but it was just rewarded the first person who knew I played was her cause she was basically the driver behind [inaudible 00:00:37:41]. But taking the field. So I was so fortunate that my first origin game was in Brisbane. For Queensland player I had to play at Lane Park, as we call it back then. It was so special. And I always said, you don’t wander up Lane Park, you float. Because there’s so much adrenaline. Yeah, the creative side, powerful and the noise reverberates from the stadium. The high gives your team. That’s one of the greatest experiences to come at the time around. And to play, as I said, just on 21 is a dream come true. And in the room before I go out around everywhere, some of the greatest players of all time, you’ve got Juan Le Roux, Al Meyer, Kevin Wallace, Mailman, Peter Jackson, Gary Belgium, all the superstars.

Billy Moore (00:38:24):

And I’m doing what I said before about the learns on a human sponge, the Amber light moment. I’m on here with these guys wondering, what are you doing? Why are you doing that? Why, after all the time that Al Meyer has been playing footy, why is he doing what he’s doing before he has on the field? It’s a great learning experience. So I’ve always been able to pull back at bit. And I’ll get emotionally wrapped up, but the whole time I have some time to learn, trying to make myself bigger, stronger, faster, smarter. So we’ve taken that field. And I had in my mind, this is what’s to be like, oh my God, I nearly started crying the first five minutes. You could not sensory overload.It was coming at you too fast, your overload, overload over couldn’t breathe. I can’t do, what’s my job.

Billy Moore (00:39:05):

Okay. I should have been over there. Let’s talk about what was he doing? How’s he doing this? What’s coming up here. You got the best of the best come at you. And doesn’t relate. Minute one is fast, 80 minutes, 79. It’s just as fast. That’s the difference between normal football and origin. It is unrelenting because of the best of the best. And talking about if you’re doing some subdivision and it’s coming in really fast, what do you do to overcome it? To me, peel back, peel back, have confidence and trust in yourself. The base you built, the knowledge that you have, the people around you that you can use to sound things off. They’re the ones who can guide you in that moment of learn. You need to surround yourself with the right people. You peel it back and you got to have confidence. Correct comes before and trust in yourself.

Billy Moore (00:39:56):

And that is born out of the [inaudible 00:39:59]. Honesty. What do you need to do to be good? Your outline. That’s what I want to be. How do I become the best? Where you honestly have to go on that path, that journey, the road of success. If on that journey, you use honesty as the pillar that makes you succeed and go forward at times of crisis. At times, it’s sensory overload. At times, when it gets really, really tough, that’s when you’re going to put yourself in the best position to be able to cope.

Ian Ugarte (00:40:29):

And so you get the sensory overload and hooked to, and this is what happens in property too. You know, you go in, you’ve got this sensory overload or trying to get this deal done and you get through the deal. And then you might say, you did have help. Our subdivision was a massively big subdivision we shouldn’t have done. We lost packet loads of money. Now in that subdivision, there was all these things going on. I couldn’t say what was going on. And then our next subdivision was a simple one of a block of land. And we just had to put another block behind it, right? So that sensory overload meant I came back and then all of a sudden went, this is easy. So you go Queensland and then you come back to club football,

Billy Moore (00:41:06):

Two great sides of my year with the Cameros and the Brisbane Broncos. Why? Because they had the best players and the best coaches and the best systems and structures in place. The best do junior bases flying through all these things. But you, that was always the game I used to love to play. And it was the highlight because it was playing against Queensland team-mates. I knew how good they were. And it was always again to test yourself. We’ve actually put a line in the sand and say, this has good Billy Moore is. And then Billy’s team is, and this is how good the Bears are. So I’d go into the sensory overload on the Wednesday we played. After we played the following weekend. So if we play on the Wednesday night and we play the Broncos or the Sunday so forth, so

Ian Ugarte (00:41:46):

So back up?

Billy Moore (00:41:48):

Back up.

Ian Ugarte (00:41:48):

And just sore? Cause you’re using muscles that because you’re going for 79 minutes, rather than the club football,

Billy Moore (00:41:55):

I always found that play comfortable. And you played a really high comp game. You’d be sore for 24 hours. Origin was 72. It was just the three days of soreness. And then it got worse. But with the brawl guys, you amped up because it was going to be a great game. And I remember having had the sensory overload. And prior to that experience at origin, the previous overload I was was a [inaudible 00:42:16]. So you were stressed because you’d have this stress and where they’re a forward pack, Glenn Lazarus and co would drive the ball forward. So you were backpedalling backpedalling. And then the ball goes from [inaudible 00:42:26], three superstar, dangerous players with ball in hand who can run and challenge and test to defence. And, basically, find whether you’ve taken the extra steps you should’ve.

Billy Moore (00:42:40):

Whether you actually had had a breather and almost let yourself down. That exposure of the witness. That’s where our lingo and [inaudible 00:42:48] . It’s an expose, a lack of honesty in yourself. You are going pretty hard. No you’re not. Because he’s going to show you, you should have gone a bit harder. So that was always the base game where we went, wow, this is the level to teach yourself.

Billy Moore (00:42:58):

And for me, that was overload. So I’ve come back from origin where you go, oh my God, this is team effect on buckling. And then you obviously have your learns. So I’m coming to play in the Broncos. And I have to say, shoot this as odd, it’s very sluggish. I actually can see what he’s doing. I actually can see why Alan’s going to do that. I know what he’s going to do. They’ve set this up now. This one will lead to that. Wait, hang on, go on the back window. I never noticed he’s going over there. Why? Because they can actually go to this side. Then they got to go over there. I’ve never seen that. On near the saying that, you know.

Billy Moore (00:43:30):

But also now, because of the learns, all of a sudden I’ve developed and got better and I could see things unfolding that I never saw before. And that’s how you become better. You’ve got to against the best to be the best.

Ian Ugarte (00:43:42):

You think about Malcolm Gladwell, right? So the outliers, you do 10,000 hours to become an expert in your field, right? You’re almost an underlier because the outlier relies on the fact that you get put in a certain position. And by doing that, you get much better. Bill Gates, right? Bill Gates started Microsoft, but he’s outlying position was that he had access to a computer lab that no other student had access to. Cause he got really friendly with one of the janitors who would let him in at nighttime. And he’d start his computer programming, right? So he was an outlier, looked like the Jewish lawyers that did really well in the U S because no one else wanted to handle litigation. They handled it, right? And they actually did.

Ian Ugarte (00:44:22):

He mentions that the old Polish under 23 to under 21 ice hockey team, the national team. They worked out that out of the 23 players, 19 or 20 of them were born between distinct months. And the reason behind that was because they realized that the age group before you went into the next age group was between a certain date. So these guys were more developed in the age group that was younger, which meant they developed at the age of 12, 13, 14, stronger and bigger, which meant they actually had more weight to them. Which meant they could push people around more. But what happened to that? They then got picked for all the rep teams, which meant they actually had more time on the ice. Which meant they got more exposure to more games and more playing.

Ian Ugarte (00:45:08):

So when you play Queensland, you can’t help but to get better at what you do. And when you play around development and property, and around the right people, you can’t help, but to get better. And so you do that, you see it also down, you actually play for Australia as well.

Billy Moore (00:45:24):

Yeah, I did. So it took a couple of years of origin, but 1995, I ended up cranking it through the Australian side. Australia’s difficult because it’s the best of the best. And Australia don’t get beaten very often. So don’t turn the solo very much. Usually that’s when opportunities present themselves. Like in life, tough times when opportunity presents, you got to be ready to take it. So for me, the opportunity eventually came to the 1995 World Cup to it, which was a great experience. So when you say on a journey and sport to play for your country, everyone says it’s not really a long distance key driver. I’ve questioned that because, to represent your country. Here you naturally had to applied where your colors of your country is a dream come true. So I did that on three occasions. And the first was in England in that World Cup tour.

Ian Ugarte (00:46:17):

So in the midst of all of this, you’re 28?

Billy Moore (00:46:19):

By this stage I was 25

Ian Ugarte (00:46:21):

  1. But at the age of 28 sibling war hits

Billy Moore (00:46:30):

So war started. it was amazing. It started in 95 and then not in 97, actually, there was two competitions happening.

Ian Ugarte (00:46:40):

So we, we had Murdoch who basically came in and started a breakaway leg. Basically split. Half of them stayed with the existing ARL and the rest of them went with the NR, which is the super league. Your Bears team decided to make a decision, which ultimately ended the team.

Billy Moore (00:47:03):

Yeah, we did. We had the opportunity. We’ll call it by simply to [inaudible 00:47:09]. And the leaders of the club, the management decided to stay loyal to the ARL and oddly in the end, and we all look back on it retrospectively if we had jumped ship.

Ian Ugarte (00:47:21):

Probably still be alive today.

Billy Moore (00:47:22):

Yeah, no doubt

Ian Ugarte (00:47:23):

But you merged. They ended up merging with the Eagles?.

Billy Moore (00:47:27):

So when they Merged with Bailey, which is their arch enemy and to form the Northern Eagles, they’re the biggest. And so I was 28 at this stage and

Ian Ugarte (00:47:36):

That’s it? Well, that’s a pretty decent rival rate for two teams that didn’t like each other very much at all.

Billy Moore (00:47:42):

Critical mistake. Manly don’t need anybody, cause Manly love to be on their own. And they love to be hated. I’m sure every league in the world,

Ian Ugarte (00:47:53):

I always support two sides, the Bunnies. And then whoever’s playing Manly great.

Billy Moore (00:47:57):

You need. That north. If we were fragile enough to merge, obviously we should have. For me, I’ve always said that to me should emerge with, was Balmain. It should have been a merge between Norse and our, my geographically side-by-side demographically, very serious and Sydney. And I think if that had happened, it would have been the best opportunity for Norse. Had we not jumped to super. That was the next best option. We didn’t do that. We went insolvent and the merger between us and Manly fell apart. I didn’t stay around for that. I decided it was time to move on.

Ian Ugarte (00:48:28):

Yeah. And so just before that happened, so you decided to retire once that merger happened. While you’re still in the ARL playing for Bears, it’s now 22, 23 years ago that you say one word that technically sets you up for a long distance in life.

Billy Moore (00:48:48):

Yeah, well you’re right. I played in 1992, game 2. And then in 1995 that sibling war we talked about starting to rage. And then that is important when that happened, easily fractured the competition. And when they came to playing representative football that year, the clubs that were aligning with the ARL, they said they’re the only ones that can play in. There was only football. Cause it’s ARL that I couldn’t go to the rep sides. So all the teams that were involved with super league, players couldn’t play. For Queensland it was hard because we lost players from Brisbane, Canberra and Canterbury. Three big teams that put players into the Queensland team. And we’ve only got a small 16% of the player group inside the NRL to pick from anyway. So when you take out those three sides our player group shrinks markedly more.

Billy Moore (00:49:38):

So we were able to pick players like Al Meyer, Steve Wallace, Kevin Wallace, Steve Ralph, all these superstars. He just retired. He just retired. So we then have a situation where our coach [inaudible 00:49:52] stood down. Cause he was always at Brisbane. So he stood down and we had no coach. We had no idea where he’s jumping into the fray.

Ian Ugarte (00:50:01):

Get coached by fatty boom-boom

Billy Moore (00:50:05):

[inaudible 00:50:05] the godfather of Queensland rugby, rings him up and says, will you coach Queensland? And so he goes, never coached. So he said, okay. So he rings up Trevor [inaudible 00:50:17] and says, Trevor, you won’t believe what’s happened. He said, I’m going to coach Queensland. This year, state of origin series. Trevor goes, bullshit. He starts laughing and he goes, don’t laugh. He goes, why?

Billy Moore (00:50:28):

You’re going to be captain. So we pick this 99 team. And can I get to be five ball? Because we had no Australian players. In the current [inaudible 00:50:42] but he’d been long retired. They had 12 county nationals in that team and we played them and we don’t, we three nil. And I look back on that as the greatest example of a champion team versus a team of champions. And collectively, we came together and used 18 players. I had one injury, all series. I’d say it’s the greatest 8 weeks in my life. But on that journey, game one of the series, we’re in sheds just before the match, Sydney football stadium, solid packed house. And we’ve got nine rookies and they’re shitting themselves. They’re nervous. You can hear the crowd through the concrete. It’s pulsating and you just see the Plaza. And the great Gary Larson turns to me and says, good boy. So my queen wine to start for you. So I told them the story that the late great Peter Jackson, my first roomy told me when I was in my first camp I roomed with him for only two games and you wouldn’t find a proud Queenslander. So what you saw coming down the town was Peter Jackson personified. And what he said, basically to be a Queenslander meant three things. And this is three wonderful things that are I carry, not only the Queensland story, but in my life and I try to pass on to people in business. Three great pillars to be successful.

Ian Ugarte (00:52:08):

Queenslander, when you hear that, said the three things.

Billy Moore (00:52:12):

Help you, mate. Find a solution and no excuses.

Ian Ugarte (00:52:16):

So we think about help you mate. Who’s that?

Billy Moore (00:52:19):

Find a solution

Billy Moore (00:52:20):

See, for me, the word professional, you know what it means? No excuses. To me, you’re paid to find a solution. That’s what you get paid to do as a professional. First of all, I believe player, when applying yourself. Well, the fact that we’ve got a one retired Australian player against 12 current nationals, that’s irrelevant. Find the solution. We are paid to win. And ultimately when you came off the field, no excuses. To me, there’s no such thing as a glorious loss for Queensland. What are you doing to put lipstick on pig?

Billy Moore (00:52:49):

For me, you basically you’re there to do a job, go and do it. And for me, when I’m in the world of all professionalism, whether it be in sport or even business, I don’t really want to hear the excuses. Because my job, as the leader, I’ll give people the resources they need to do the job. And by seeing them go and do it power by empowerment, I believe. And that’s why help me find a solution and no excuses to may be the key drivers for the success of the Queensland Jersey. And that’s been reverberated through the times.

Billy Moore (00:53:22):

So I’ve told these guys in the chain shed that this is what it is to be a Queenslander. Pump them up. I said, the great Peter Jackson told me that’s all had been a Queenslander. I started screaming Queenslander. All seven of us were screaming Queenslander. And I told my lines in the sheds, we’ve turned, we’ve walked down the rise to go on the field and [inaudible 00:53:43] put camera in the towel. First ever time

Ian Ugarte (00:53:46):

So let’s just get this right. The term Queenslander had existed for many, many years,

Billy Moore (00:53:50):

Over 10 years.

Ian Ugarte (00:53:52):

Over 10 years. And channel nine decides to put a camera for the first time in the tunnel. And you’ve just rallied up these young fellas and they captured the moment and.

PART 2 OF 4 ENDS [00:54:04]

Billy Moore (00:54:03):


Ian Ugarte (00:54:03):

And they captured the moment. Why don’t we watch this moment right now.

Ian Ugarte (00:54:07):

So you can hear that. In the background there, Ray says, “Billy Moore’s obviously very pumped up.”

Billy Moore (00:54:12):

And I was and that was a special game. We went out and we won that game 2-0. 2-0.

Ian Ugarte (00:54:17):

That’s the first game ever though that they hadn’t scored a try.

Billy Moore (00:54:17):

Yeah. Yeah. And it’ll never happen again. And what was amazing was those nine rookies, they took their chances.

Billy Moore (00:54:29):

I mentioned before about opportunities, we train in life, and whether it be in business or sport or with your family, to get ready for an opportunity, to take it, and these guys took it. Some of those guys never played again. They played that one series and that was it.

Ian Ugarte (00:54:43):

That was it.

Billy Moore (00:54:45):

And I look back on… And they were the greats of that series because, Craig, Eve and those sort of guys, had their one chance, they took it. And then they moved off in to now into, I suppose, in history in Queensland rugby league. And that’s what life’s about. They had Andrew Johns, Brad Hitler, Jimmy Dymock, they had absolute superstars in that team… Jeff Tome, they had so many great players and they couldn’t get through our defensive line and our young guys in the back, especially, defended so well. You just see the frustration building in them. So I look back and think that that is talked about as the “Queenslander call,” but really, when you peel it back, go into deep, the psyche of what those blokes did, the way they took their chance and relished the opportunity was brilliant.

Ian Ugarte (00:55:31):

It means something much more than New South Wales has…

Billy Moore (00:55:34):


Ian Ugarte (00:55:34):

And that’s what made them. Now just tell us that one story about the little tussle you had with a [crosstalk 00:55:43]

Billy Moore (00:55:42):

Mr. Barn hill?

Ian Ugarte (00:55:43):


Billy Moore (00:55:48):

Yeah, well, that was game two of that series. So we head down to Melbourne three weeks later and, like happens in Origin today, two teams will have simultaneous team meetings in their respective hotels, they’ll get in their buses, they go to the ground and do battle. So, New South Wales had their team meeting and Phil Gould was their coach and… Most successful coach in Origin history, behind Mal Meningei of course. And he’s come in and he gave a powerful speech, he’s really powerful. And he’s really good at giving that short, sharp, punchy speech thing. Succinct, he goes, “Three weeks ago, you got beaten by a bunch of bums. See those Queenslander?,” he said, “If anyone say’s ‘Queenslander’ tonight, I want you to punch him in the head.” That was the whole tactics they had, that was it, right. They didn’t do anything else in their team meeting.

Billy Moore (00:56:33):

What he didn’t realize is that, Fatty Vaunting, our coach, his best mate was the junior water runner for New South Wales, he’s run out and rang Fatty and told him exactly what had just been said. So he’s walked into our hotel room at the other side of the city, couple of minutes later, he said, “Boys, I’ve just found out the tactics for New South Wales, if you say ‘Queenslander,’ you’re going to get punched. Hands up who is going to say it.”

Ian Ugarte (00:56:53):

All of you.

Billy Moore (00:56:56):

Everyone, 17 hands go straight up.

Billy Moore (00:56:58):

So we go to match and five minutes into the game, we have a scrum. And we go to the scrum and we know somethings on. So we pack down our front row go, “Queenslander,” and they’ve come up and they got their guns loaded and ready to go. The New South Wales front row’s popped up, Paul Larrigan, Jimmy Risperdal, Mark “Spud” Carol, they’ve popped up and they’ve gone, “Queenslander? What was that? What was it Queenslander?”

Ian Ugarte (00:57:16):

And it was on.

Billy Moore (00:57:21):

Oh, bang. Now I’m in the back and if you ever see the footage, I’m at the back, I’ve come running around, looking, “Oh, you’re busy.” And everyone was busy, everybody was involved. And I’m not condoning violence but I eventually fling at a bloke called David Barn hill, nicknamed “Barbie.” And he’s got an operatic voice like Gary Larson with a few of us footballers. “Speaks like this.” And he goes, “Mate, what do you reckon?” I said “Swing it” He goes, “Righto, let’s dance.” So we start throwing them and I threw 100 punches and they all missed. After all that training with Johnny Lewis. He’s never spoken to me ever since.

Ian Ugarte (00:57:54):

But Barn hill said something to you, after a tussle… This is on YouTube, you can see it, it’s still there.

Billy Moore (00:57:58):

Yeah, it’s embarrassing. But yeah, you can watch it because as I said I don’t condone violence but I certainly didn’t pop the…

Ian Ugarte (00:58:03):

Well, there was no violence in it. You were just tussling, right?

Billy Moore (00:58:06):

No. Eventually only one punch connected. We’ve wrestled and we’ve fallen on the ground, we’re both behind the sidings. We get up, we’ve broken away from the main group and we’ve bent over and we’re actually sublimed to give each other wedgies, that’s how pathetic we were. We were shot, we were that tired. Right in front of the Great Southern Stand. So there’s 40 odd thousand in that stand and they’re pissing themselves laughing at our pretend fight. Well, we weren’t pretending, but it looked like we were.

Billy Moore (00:58:28):

And David Barn hill goes, “Mate, I’ve had enough.” I said, “Sweet,” he goes, “Righto, we’ll call it a draw?” I said, “Sweet,” let him go, and he fucking hit me.

Ian Ugarte (00:58:35):

He hit you after that.

Billy Moore (00:58:36):

Anyway, moral of the story is, never trust a New South Welshman, ladies and gentleman.

Ian Ugarte (00:58:41):

So, you retire at a fairly young age. There’s a good four to six years, if not longer in you.

Billy Moore (00:58:48):

Well, I’d actually planned… surprise, surprise, my goal setting and plans which I did this morning, I do all the time. I had a plan, I was 28. I wanted to play at North’s for another four years, 32. Break 300 games, probably set the club record. Then I wanted to go to England or France and play over there for two years, but across the whole off season. I wanted to immerse myself in another countries’ culture. That’d be 34. I would have come back to my home area and played where I grew up and play for nothing just to be back home. And then I would have pursued in my life… I got a science degree in physiology. So…

Ian Ugarte (00:59:26):

Because that was a big push back then for the rugby league players to go off and do study as well.

Billy Moore (00:59:29):

Yeah, yep. So I did that. I would either come back and got into sports science side of rugby league, so I started a master’s degree. Or I would have gone down the path of being, probably in management. Any one of those was what I was planned. But then at 28, my life changed. As fast as I lifted up from Allargando, I basically went back down again and the speed was breathtaking.

Ian Ugarte (00:59:55):

Because you move back to… or, you moved to the Sunshine Coast?

Billy Moore (00:59:58):

Yeah, I did. I basically left Sydney, moved back to the Sunny… Got up to the Sunny Coast, never been there. Got involved in small business. I built a restaurant in Basaloma and bought a pub in Toowoomba, and they were all disasters. I said, “FAIL; first attempt in learning.” Well, that was my first attempt in learning. And it was a big learn. I rose up, through Armada moment. And the broken jaw, mate, it took me up to another level. And then, my life was going great. And I was 28, I was mixing in the North Sydney business community, I had plans, I had the next 10 years mapped out. And then at 28 it basically collapsed. Got pneumonia which, obviously, quasi ended the career, but then Norths merged with Manly and I decided to come up here and got into small business. As I said, those first two years were shocking and peeling it away…

Ian Ugarte (01:00:53):

Because you went into a restaurant, never having done that before.

Billy Moore (01:00:55):


Ian Ugarte (01:00:57):

You just thought, “I’d go into hospitality,” bought a pub. In the end that pub had to be used as a men’s pub…

Billy Moore (01:01:01):


Ian Ugarte (01:01:01):

As you say, to be able to get something out of it.

Billy Moore (01:01:01):


Ian Ugarte (01:01:04):

And then you had this high end restaurant. So out of all the retail to be in, high end restaurants would have to be one of the hardest ones.

Billy Moore (01:01:13):

First floor, high end retail. I remember people telling me, when they heard I was into trouble, they said, “Oh, first floor restaurants in a tourist town are a recipe for disaster.” I said, “No one told me that.”

Ian Ugarte (01:01:27):

No. And so you go into this restaurant and you’re watching the numbers. So you went back to the same lessons that you’ve always used, and you’ve got to go, “My Armada moment was, what does the best look like? And how do I measure across that?” Because, the restaurant was failing ridiculously…

Billy Moore (01:01:44):

Yeah I was burning cash.

Ian Ugarte (01:01:45):

… So you then rang someone in the industry that knew their stuff, and you said to them, “What are the figures? What are they supposed to be? Because, I don’t even know what they are.”

Billy Moore (01:01:53):

Yeah. I’d eat in restaurants, like everyone that’s watching this now, we’ve all eaten in restaurants, cafes, bars. You think, “Oh, it’d be nice to have one of those.” So I went and built one because I had a bit of cash left over from my footy career and, in the end, that was the worst mistake I made because I went under prepared.

Billy Moore (01:02:08):

Now, I think back, and I’ll talk about it later on, but four key things that the transition across from sport into small business and what makes success there. But, I went under prepared and basically hung myself out to dry. And over the course of two years, things went from bad to worse. Getting divorced, trial, heaps of money. I was drunk for the majority of it. And it wasn’t till I started dating Carrie. I remember going into a dress shop with her and I went up to the counter while she was doing her thing, I was looking for something to read and there was this Dalai Lama prophecy book. I open it up and it just jumped out off the pages, as an epiphany. “If you’re looking for a helping hand, look no further than the end of your own wrist. If you’re looking for a helping hand, look no further than your own wrist.”

Billy Moore (01:02:58):

To me, that said everything. The helping hand was here. I was looking for someone else to come in and solve my problems. I realized in that moment, I was the problem, but I was also the solution. And I was the one with the hands on the wheel on that road to success we talked about, going past those guideposts, chasing those goals, becoming bigger, stronger, faster, smarter. It was my hands. I was waiting for someone else to come along. I’d forgotten my Armada moment. I forgot that this real secret to success is finding what the best looked like, copying it. What do you do? How you do it and why? Ask those questions.

Billy Moore (01:03:35):

So that’s when I went to people in the industry, and said, “What does a successful restaurant look like?” And I got laid out there. That’s the balance sheets, P&Ls. That’s what the good ones look like. And I married them up with what I was doing and go, “Wait on”. I could then quantify success. I can see the difference. I can see as a 15 year old kid, how good I was compared to those Australian school boys. I got to see success, I quantified the difference. That was the road map to start the turn [crosstalk 01:04:05]

Ian Ugarte (01:04:04):

So you managed to… And so to this day, one of the most successful things you’ve done is being able to turn that restaurant around to a point where you got the figures so that you could sell it.

Billy Moore (01:04:14):

Yeah, didn’t make any money. No.

Ian Ugarte (01:04:15):

But you sold it.

Billy Moore (01:04:16):

I sold it. I kept my pants on, got out. And tell you what I did do is I learnt a lot. You learn a lot from what we talked about, the first attempt in learning, tell you what, when you actually have to scrape… Or that development where you struggle the first time, I bet you you learn a lot.

Ian Ugarte (01:04:35):

That $300,000 loss.

Billy Moore (01:04:37):


Ian Ugarte (01:04:38):

Has taught me everything in property.

Billy Moore (01:04:40):

Isn’t it a shame you’ve got to go through the burn, the pain, the negativity? And I imagine, like right now the [inaudible 01:04:48] we’re in. What is going to be the learns that we’re all going to come through off the back end of Corona virus. And that’s what I mean, it sounds terrible, but that’s what the golden opportunity is right now. Now is the time to learn. Now is the time to take out of what presents itself and in the face of adversity, there’s always some good. As Pat said, “You’ve just got to have the courage and determination to find the good.”

Billy Moore (01:05:10):

So it took me a while, but eventually I turned it around and I get more excited about talking about the turn then I do about to the peak playing for Queensland and Australia. Much as I loved that, it was sensation. But the reality is when I talk to people at the end of this lens, I’m sure the majority have had a situation where they’ve gone through a dip, something’s gone wrong. A bad decision, whether it’s they’re own making or not, they’re paying for it. Bodily, financially, physically, I mean whatever it is. They’re trying to come back out of it. And for me, the recipe of getting out of it, was great.

Billy Moore (01:05:46):

And I learned that the key thing’s the turn. On the turn, [inaudible 01:05:52]. One of them that you love is mentors. On the dip from North Sydney to [inaudible 01:05:59]. When I was down in Sydney, playing for Australia, to where I hit the rock bottom, I realized in analyzing back, I had no mentors. I had no one around me. Had no one to bounce things off. I had no one to say, “Billy, you’re a fool.” Or, “Billy, actually, this is your learn here.” I was sensory overload again. I was playing Origin, I was overwhelmed. The negativity hit me so hard. I was out of my comfort zone, I was stressed. I didn’t know what to do, where to turn, who to speak to. And I stopped talking. The helping hands were actually to make me to pick up the phone, to go and find someone. To drive to go and ask someone.

Billy Moore (01:06:29):

So to the people who need help, mentors are very important and to continue success. If you want to continue sustained success, having mentors around you is very important.

Ian Ugarte (01:06:40):

Yeah. And what most people here don’t realize is that you are extremely successful in business. You decided at that point in time. So part of that too, is what Jarvis has said to you. You don’t deserve anything, right? And at the bottom of that, you thought I deserve for this restaurant to [inaudible 01:06:54]. Well, no the hands have to do what they have to do. So you decide never to go into retail, at least not restaurants ever again, but then Aug ello’s pops up.

Billy Moore (01:07:03):

Yeah, I had an opportunity. I had a coffee with a great friend of mine. He was in Aug ello’s for 20, he was in there 25 years.

Ian Ugarte (01:07:10):

So before you bought into Aug ello’s it had already been operating for 25?

Billy Moore (01:07:14):

Yeah, sorry. I’ve been there eight years. So 17 years before me. So I’d known Simon and his former partner Paul, who I end up buying him out. And I actually had coffee with Simon. He said “Do you want to but half of Aug ello’s?” I went, ” Piss off, I’m not going to go back in this again.” He goes, “Well, I know what happened at Earth. This is a given, this beast is different, this is our figures, this is what the buy in, this is the return investment, blah, blah, blah.” I went, “Oh, it looks a bit too good to be true.” So what I did is I used a little bit of bouse from being burnt. I actually went and worked, did due diligence first all my life. It sounds terrible I basically put a little bit of confidence in me finding the right answer, rather than…

Ian Ugarte (01:07:56):

Well, it doesn’t sound terrible. I mean to… We’ve done that before, we were going to buy a restaurant. And when you went and worked every week for about six months in this restaurant, for free, because I wanted to see the ins and outs, I wanted to firstly understand the business, but you’d already had an understanding of business. In the end we didn’t go ahead with that. But for you, you sat in the restaurant and there was a reason that… You saw the figures, but there was a reason that you were there, you were looking for where you could make improvements.

Billy Moore (01:08:21):

Yeah. And what I noticed so quickly, the difference between Earth and Aug ello’s was the business model at Aug ello’s was so much better. It was smaller, tighter, family friendly food. Whereas Earth was a big palatial five-star restaurant, and it was more top end.

Ian Ugarte (01:08:42):

Two hour lunches [crosstalk 01:08:46].

Billy Moore (01:08:45):

Large overheads, because of the size, all those factors. Because of the style it took more man-hours to produce the food and the way… Just the business model wasn’t right.

Billy Moore (01:08:55):

But when I got to Aug ello’s, I realized after so many years of success and having been where I’d been and scraped the barrel, that there was some input I could put it into the business and question a few things. Because when you continually have success, year after year, you almost get, well, complacent, and this is life. So my input there was having come from the bottom of the barrel was “Oh, by the way, I know if you do this, this and this, we can improve these areas.” And I was able pass on some of those, I suppose, the learns I’d had for the pain of Earth, transitioning into Aug ello’s. And realize that there was ways to continually improve.

Billy Moore (01:09:35):

And the business has grown and grown. And it’s got better… I’ve been fortunate, having great mentors and great business partners around me on that journey. Because Aug ello’s [crosstalk 01:09:44].

Ian Ugarte (01:09:43):

Because Simon was asking you in to buy out another partner, but little did he know that you were in there to improve even more? And for those of you who are listening any business where you can increase prices by 10%, you can reduce your overheads by 10% and increase your business by 10%, your bottom line will increase. So your profit will increase by 300%. Just by doing those simple things. Right?

Ian Ugarte (01:10:08):

And you’d set again, set yourself your goals that by X amount of time, 10% up, 10%. And you did that really easy.

Billy Moore (01:10:15):

Yeah, thank… Because they had the same situation, same management style for so long. So we’re coming in and pretty well do the squeeze on here and there. We were able to sharpen the pencil on suppliers…

Ian Ugarte (01:10:25):

It’s a simple thing, I mean, the supplies, the alcohol suppliers as example. That was a huge saving.

Billy Moore (01:10:29):

Yeah. And you find that, just by shopping around. And also in a competitive world we’ve since I first started that mold, we’ve actually transitioned to a major international supplier. And again, they wanted our business because they saw us as strong and competitive. And that’s a great thing. When someone sees strength, they want to be with that strength. And they’re prepared to offer… To get into the family, they’re prepared to cut some deals. And we found that at Aug ello’s as we’ve got stronger, we’re going to cut more and more deals.

Ian Ugarte (01:11:03):

You attract more, yeah.

Ian Ugarte (01:11:04):

Now, there’s a couple things, Michael Colbert, I don’t know if you know his name, but can you tell us how you know Billy Michael? Just punch it in the actual circumstances around that. Now, for all of you in there, Bianca brought up a really good point. So this weekend, we’ve been talking about the hero’s journey. Kung Fu Panda, you get the chosen one, by accident and then goes through this whole training, breaks the jaw. So it starts to test his friends and allies. Out comes Steve Roach, you think he’s an enemy, but he’s actually an ally in your pocket men.

Ian Ugarte (01:11:43):

And then you get to that point where the supreme ordeal is, we’ve finally where I’ve left football and the supreme ordeal is, I’m in the middle of Earth. And then you’ve got this mastery, right? So, and this has happened all this weekend for the two days, we’ve been working, this precipice of around the hero’s journey starting again, and then starting again and reaching the next level, the next level. Now you are in there, you’re comfortable, you get a phone call from one of the biggest brewery companies in the world.

Billy Moore (01:12:06):

Yeah, I did, I did. So this was 2012. So I’d basically just started at Aug ello’s, I’d been there about a year or so. So 2012, I retired in 1999. I said the “Queensland call” in 1995. So we’re a fair way down the track from the book of Rugby League actually being closed, put on the shelf. And I’m already holding the book.

Ian Ugarte (01:12:28):

Because it becomes folklore, when anyone my age, hears the term Queenslander, you don’t think about the Queensland team. You think about Billy Moore.

Billy Moore (01:12:36):

Coming down that tunnel, the crazed look in his eyes and that he doesn’t know the camera’s there, but he’s going berserk. So I got a phone call, so I’m already behind the bar at Aug ello’s and a phone call, “Day, Billy this is Johnny Smith from Line.” Which is owned by Kirin brewing out of Japan. So the second biggest brewer in the world. “We want you to be the face of our Origin campaign for 2012. Basically that’ll be a very extensive program, billboards, TV ads, social media, blah, blah, blah.” And I’ve gone “Mate, who is this?” And I didn’t believe it was it… I thought it was a few old teammates taking a joke out of me.

Billy Moore (01:13:19):

But it was obviously who he was said he was. And what it was is it was a campaign, extensive campaign, because 4X were the main sponsor of QRL. And what it turned out to be was 93 roadside billboards, a TVC campaign put across prime time TV in Queensland, across all of Queensland from Cairns all the way down to the South East, social media which I had no idea with a big emphasis on social media, in print media as well. And I said, “You’re kidding me.” He goes, “Yes, this is the deal.” He said, “I’ll send you through the scope of works.” He said, “Think about it and come back with a price.” And I said, “No problems.”

Billy Moore (01:14:05):

So he sent through a fax with the scope of works, and I went “Oo, that’s pretty impressive.” Well it looked like at a lot of words, so I’m thinking a lot of words, I think a lot of words, a lot of money. I had no idea.

Ian Ugarte (01:14:15):

But I think that the point of this story is that your mother was your manager and she was a very good negotiator and that’s now bread through into you too.

Billy Moore (01:14:22):

Well, so I thought, well, first of all, I’ve got to actually articulate what is the right value for this? I had no idea. And all the people that hung around, most of them probably had no idea either. So I rang up the ball boy at North Sydney, a guy called Jason Hodges. Great bloke who, Better Homes and Gardens.

Ian Ugarte (01:14:38):

Who only just finished on Homes and Gardens.

Billy Moore (01:14:41):

He’s the fat gardener who’s been making more money… He was the ball boy, he now makes more money than all of us. I rang him up and said, “Mate, can you help me?” “Yeah, sure mate.” “What it is,” I said, “I got this phone call from Line about doing this campaign.” I said, “Here, I’ll show what it is.” And I sent him the fax. He goes, “Oh, that’s pretty good. Gee, that’s good.” I said, “Well, how much is that worth?” He goes, “Well, look, I would charge a hundred and something thousand dollars for that.” But he said, “You can’t.” I said, “Why not?” He said, “Well look Billy, your profile’s gone mate.” He said, “Look, I would charge at this level.”

Ian Ugarte (01:15:10):

So, lets not say any figures so we don’t know what the end contract was.

Billy Moore (01:15:11):

So, yeah, “This is what I would charge.” Well I said “All right, no problems.” So that way, he calibrates in the fact that you had a… You did what you did, but the reality of life is you’ve drifted off into the sunset and you’re not forgotten, but your files very dusty, so to speak. So, I get a phone call from Line and they said, “Okay, have you thought about your price?” I said, “Yeah, I have. I want this.” And they’ve gone “What?” And I said, “Yeah, that.” And they said, “No, no, no, no.” They said, “How did you get that price?” I said, “Well, I’ve been to someone in the industry, they reckon I have a lesser profile. So they would have charged X, I’ve gone X minus Y. So that’s where I arrived at this figure.” He said, “We’re not going to pay that.” I said, “Well, what are you going to pay?” He said, “We’ll give you half of that.” I said, “Oh, okay.” He said, “You okay with that?” And I said, ” Well, no, actually I’m not really.” I said, “Look, thanks very much for the opportunity. But I’m happy to stay off in the sunset really” Three….

Ian Ugarte (01:16:07):

And that’s ballsy, that’s ballsy. Because, the half was still okay. But there was a lot of work involved in that. And it’s ballsy to walk around this. Now, I think what’s important out of this story is that, previous to that phone call, only a matter of maybe six months or earlier, Carrie had said… You’d said to Carrie, “What do you want to do?” And she said, “I want to run the New York marathon.” And she said, “But you’re doing it with me.” So you actually weighed 16 kilos heavier than when that phone call happened.

Billy Moore (01:16:39):

Yeah, exactly right, I’d blown right out because I was a publican and a restaurateur, and I enjoyed those pursuits very well. So I, for the first of my life, I’d had no fitness. So I started getting fit, and…

Ian Ugarte (01:16:51):

And there’s no exclusivity to success.

Billy Moore (01:16:53):

No, I tell you what I know, I think back to some of those training runs. To the 10K or the 15K, which when you’re in training mode, when you’re in, actually, marathon phase that’s, you don’t get up for 10Ks. But I was struggling really hard to run those and Carrie’s burn me off and left me in her wake. So I actually got better, I got fitter, I trimmed right down.

Billy Moore (01:17:12):

So I got this phone call and I hung up and said “Mate, look I’m not going to worry about it.” Hung up. Three days later, they ring back and they said, “You’re serious, you’re prepared to walk away from this.” I said, “Yeah, I am actually.” They said, “Oh, well, we didn’t think you’d be so staunch”. I said, “Look mate, I found out my value, I believed in the value, I’m confident in what I can provide you. And if you don’t see [inaudible 01:17:31] reality, like I see it, well so be it, happy to walk away.” He goes, “Righto, we’ll give you half of what you wanted.” And they said, “Are you happy with that?” I said, “Look, okay, but I’m going to just do half the work.” They said “Well, let’s look, I’ll give you…If you’re going to pay half the money, I’ll just do half of what you wanted. And I itemized some things that I was going to do.” And I’ll back myself, thinking okay.

Ian Ugarte (01:17:51):

So you pull some things out of the contract and left other things in.

Billy Moore (01:17:54):

So what I pulled out was the billboards and the TVC, they did the social media, which everyone told me that this is the power of the future, this is 2012. So we do the social media ad and again you can get this on YouTube.

Ian Ugarte (01:18:08):

Well let’s watch the ad. So I was sitting in the restaurant. And do you text it to me before it actually went out, and I went “Oh, what a balls up, this is going to hit like crazy right.” So, let’s play that ad for you right now.

Ian Ugarte (01:18:23):

So there you have it, right I saw that and I went, that is going to go crazy.

Billy Moore (01:18:27):

I said Queenslander that day, that’s the only word I said. Basically…

Ian Ugarte (01:18:30):

The whole day.

Billy Moore (01:18:32):

Whole day. There were 15 people on set, all on the other side of the camera. 800 times, I screamed it. And each time with the same venom and passion as I did coming out of the tunnel that day. [inaudible 01:18:44], I was gone.

Ian Ugarte (01:18:45):

You actually had someone put to you to actually say you could point [crosstalk 01:18:52]

Billy Moore (01:18:52):

Because my voice was going. They said, don’t talk at all today. Just the people that were minding me. So whatever you need, you just point, we’ll get it for you. And at the end of the day, that was filmed, they said we’re going to see you again tomorrow. I thought, I can’t do tomorrow. Thank God, the next day was still shots. So there was no voice required.

Billy Moore (01:19:08):

But I was like you, I saw the concept and I said, this will work. That’s why I pulled the TVC, because I knew that would be the real marketing barometer. Once I got out there that would be the real paycheck for me, and it’d be back up. But the social media was going to be the conduit to it, cause it had the [inaudible 01:19:27] fingers out in society.

Billy Moore (01:19:29):

So they ran with that campaign. Half value, half work. And what proceeded to happen is Tom Bills was the guy. Day Tom, he’s a champion bloke. He rang me back up and said, “Billy,” he said, a couple of weeks later, he goes, “Billy, can we extend the deal?” I said, “Why?” He goes, “It’s going through the roof.”

Ian Ugarte (01:19:48):

[crosstalk 01:19:48] Cray, cray. It’s gone good.

Billy Moore (01:19:49):

It had half a million hits.

Ian Ugarte (01:19:51):

In no time at all.

Billy Moore (01:19:52):

So I said, “Okay.” He said, “So what do you want?” I said, “I want the other half thanks Tom.” So I got it all in the end.

Ian Ugarte (01:19:57):

So you got it all in the end. But whats was more important out of that, was that Billy Moore had become an unknown. Other than the memory from people my age and whatever, you’d become an unknown. But because of that ad campaign, we had six year old, seven year olds, 10 year olds, 12 year olds running around the house, yelling Queenslander and knowing your name again.

Billy Moore (01:20:15):

Exactly right, and because I did it with the passion, the venom and honesty I always do things, I worked for 4X for the next five years. And I had some great experiences like running onto the field just prior to the players and revving the crowd up.

Billy Moore (01:20:26):

To give you an idea of how good it worked is the following year they made their own origin jerseys, which you could go and pick up from bottle shops if you bought products for 4X. They thought they were going to have 30,000 jersey sales. They had to open up two or three more factories in China, because they ended up going through 130,000 of these jerseys.

Billy Moore (01:20:46):

So, it was great for me. And what it allowed is the revival of Billy Moore, because as I said, I had turned it around in the early 00s and I was on the way back up, but I really wanted the platform to be able to tell the turn story of…

PART 3 OF 4 ENDS [01:21:04]

Billy Moore (01:21:03):

… really wanted the platform to be able tell the turn story of how I had brought my life back out of the dip, which translated to people… We have the pleasure of talking to people. We all talked about playing for Australia, Queensland. People go, “Ah that’s…” You just see their eyes going, “That’s a nice little story.” But it’s when I told them about making the dip, the errors which quite turned into the learns, everyone in the room, you can just see them go, “Yeah, we’ve had those issues. We’ve had adversity. We either have, or trying to overcome it.” And I get a lot more sense of pride.

Billy Moore (01:21:34):

So when I think about the things I mentioned, the four key things from business which translate across, I mentioned one of them is mentors. The other key I find is, the 1%ers do matter. As you get into business, like in sport, to get better and better, you’ve got to remember that it gets harder and harder. In your deals you do, and with developments, it’ll be the same, people jockeying for the same opportunities, 1%ers make a difference. And you must articulate that to yourself and the people in your team that the 1% is caring and making sure you pay attention. Fight and scramble for those 1%sers, that’s how you become a success. Because all of a sudden, a couple of percent becomes 4%, becomes 5%. We’re talking now the difference between success and failure, to then being way more successful, but very successful. And it’s about clamming for those 1%s. That’s one key thing I found.

Billy Moore (01:22:33):

The other one I find is getting the right people on the bus. If you’re in a position of being able to select those around you, whether it be suppliers, staff, wherever it may be, I always find that getting the right people on the bus. And there’s a great saying that A-graders recruit A-graders, B-graders recruit C-graders. Someone who actually is not on the top of his game, they want to get people around that actually aren’t as good. They become yes, people. Whereas an A-grader is not afraid to have people in the room smarter than them.

Billy Moore (01:23:04):

That’s what Mal Maninga was so good as the Queensland coach. He’s not a brilliant coach, with all due respect to Mal, he’s great at getting people around him that are really good at doing certain jobs in that team. So he wasn’t afraid of having other guys that were probably better coaches, but he knew he could man manage, and he managed his coaches.

Billy Moore (01:23:21):

And then the fourth thing I’ve found in business that really makes success, and I asked Craig Bellamy, the most successful coach in the last 15 years, Bennet’s been the most successful over 25. The last 15 Bellamy has really-

Ian Ugarte (01:23:33):

Bellamy was Bennet’s understudy.

Billy Moore (01:23:36):

Right, yes. And before that he was with a guy called Tim Sheens, [inaudible 01:23:41] two great sides. And he learned from both those guys and he’s been amazing successful not only at winning competitions, but at producing on a conveyor belt, people. He gets average and makes good. Good, great. He puts polish on the diamond. “How do you do that?” I had a chance to ask him. And surprise, surprise its very simple. He said, “How I make success happen,” in not himself, but those around him, he simplifies it.

Billy Moore (01:24:08):

And each game for the Melbourne Storm, every person on the field has three KPIs. Ian has three jobs, and Billy has three jobs. Cameron Smith before a game he has three jobs. Billy Slater had three jobs. Cooper Cronk had three jobs. The guy coming off the bench who might get [inaudible 01:24:26], he had three jobs. Everybody knew exactly what had to happen, what their job was for that team to have success. Do your job. No excuses, do your job, do your three things.

Billy Moore (01:24:39):

And he knew that if everybody did their job, that the ball would be in the position with the right hands, with the right player, with the defensive line fatigued, so the opportunities for success would be at its highest. So I found that, when you think about business, does anyone on your team know exactly what their job is? Do they know what success they have for today, to have a successful outcome? What are the three jobs today for me to do? What are my three jobs this week? What are my three jobs this month? Whatever it may be, conveying I think to those around you and even yourself. And that’s where goal setting comes in, conveying what success looks like, and these are my three targets. You can do four if you want to, but you don’t get [crosstalk 01:25:23].

Ian Ugarte (01:25:24):

But you have to do those three.

Billy Moore (01:25:24):

Have to, otherwise you have a serious conversation.

Ian Ugarte (01:25:25):

And Craig Bellamy, if they don’t do the first three and they do the fourth, they’re out the next week. Because Craig Bellamy’s done extraordinary to piece, usually two or three superstars and piece the team around. Now, Craig Bellamy buys players from other clubs that have been playing for five to 10 years, and turns them into great players, or good players at least. Where they were average before, they’re now good players. Why? Because they’ve got three simple things to follow, and they just prosper and they flow around the three superstars.

Billy Moore (01:25:55):

And the other thing about those players, he buys them cheap.

Ian Ugarte (01:25:57):


Billy Moore (01:25:58):

He buys something-

Ian Ugarte (01:25:59):

And then sells them expensive. And when they go, they don’t have that first [inaudible 01:26:03].

Billy Moore (01:26:05):

Never ever buy a [crosstalk 01:26:05] player. The only one that’s ever been able to do that and go away and be successful is Cooper Cronk, because he was so determined.

Ian Ugarte (01:26:13):

He was one of the three superstars though, wasn’t he?

Billy Moore (01:26:15):

He was.

Ian Ugarte (01:26:15):

Inglis did it as well, superstars both. These are superstars. But anyone peripheral to those superstars that have been bought by other clubs from Melbourne, never done anything.

Billy Moore (01:26:24):

Another key point I find, and Craig Bellamy uses it in talking about these are your three KPIs is the communication channels. You’ve got to be able to communicate. And on my dip, I stopped communicating. Had no mentors, and on the way down I stopped communicating to all of them.

Billy Moore (01:26:39):

So I think communication too, having open lines of communication. Especially in a leadership role, you never ever talk down. You’ve got to have always talking up. So you want to have a situation inside your staff where the two ICs or three ICs, they don’t talk down to the lower troops, they’ve got to always talk up. Because, to solve problems, the communication channels have got to be coming up. If you have a cap on it and you’re not listening or there’s no ability for [inaudible 01:27:08] to talk up, they’ll keep talking and it’ll cause infestation.

Ian Ugarte (01:27:12):

Interesting you should say that, because yesterday we put up a little sign that said everyone needs a [Josey 01:27:18]. And Josey is the one that talks up to me. And we’ve got Biancha and a few others that are part of the crew here that are always looking out and saying, “But what if? What if? What if?” And if I was not to listen to that.

Ian Ugarte (01:27:35):

Now, sometimes they’re saying, what if, and I’ve already thought about it, but if I didn’t listen to that, then that’s going to create some angst with them and it’s going to then… Our business is surviving through Corona because of that whole structure and the amazing, amazing work that they’ve all done to stay here. Now you’re in the restaurant business. So you are open for trade, but only for takeaway.

Billy Moore (01:28:06):

Yeah, we’ve gone from 1000 man-hours to run Augello’s from 8:00 AM until 9:00 PM, seven days a week. We close Christmas Day only. This is our 25th year, so we’re a bit of a local furniture model, people know we’re there. But we’ve gone from 1000 man-hours to 120. So we’re doing takeaways between 5:00 and 7:30, five days a week. So that Sunday we do from 12:00 to 7:30. 85% of trade’s gone. We will survive. We will learn how to do this. We will become bigger, stronger, faster, smarter off the back of it. And one of the key things we’ve got there is great staff.

Billy Moore (01:28:34):

Their confidence from the get-go, we will survive. We will be here. We’ll be the last to shut, first to open, because we didn’t know at one stage, we thought we were going to shut, they were going to shut us. And we said, we will stay until they actually come and lock our doors. We will not be giving in here.

Billy Moore (01:28:47):

And thankfully we’ve been left alone. And I think the signs are great. The infection rates dropping and we’ll come out of it. The learnings out of this year will be great, and I can’t wait to sit down and analyze it. But at the other side of it, we’re right in the middle of the war zone for want of a better term. And I’m proud of the way our customer base is seeing us, they’re visiting Augello’s.

Ian Ugarte (01:29:08):

I would have to say, arguably, you’d have to have the number one spot in Mooloolabah.

Billy Moore (01:29:16):

We definitely do. We’re right at the crossroads, overlooking the water, and then opposite-

Ian Ugarte (01:29:19):

Every window with a view.

Billy Moore (01:29:20):


Ian Ugarte (01:29:20):

So you actually did the smart thing there, you bought that property.

Billy Moore (01:29:25):


Ian Ugarte (01:29:26):

It was cheaper to own it than to rent it.

Billy Moore (01:29:28):


Ian Ugarte (01:29:28):

Mooloolabah has one of the highest retail commercial rents in the country.

Billy Moore (01:29:33):

Exactly right. So for us, we were 30% better off. One of the great things I’ve looked back now, what I learned from my first business to the second, was own the premises. Be your own landlord.

Ian Ugarte (01:29:47):


Billy Moore (01:29:48):

That’s been a good learn. When I think about the current terms and to all our listeners, I did a podcast on men’s health last week, and some key things I was able to think about there that are important for me individually, what I’m using as principals to come through this bigger, stronger, faster, and smarter. One of the things I look at is, important to control the controls.

Billy Moore (01:30:13):

So in the fall I was out of control, I had no idea. But now when I stumble, and I still do, we still have learns along the journey. But what I realized is I don’t want to jump at shadows. I always say, control the controls. Very important. Make sure then, once you’re in the controllable zone, it’s really important you get a rhythm to your life. Get a rhythm and make sure you have a pattern and be honest with that rhythm. Because I think the real key to success is momentum.

Billy Moore (01:30:45):

Those that are successful, you can just see how they build momentum and they keep it going. Especially through tough times, I mentioned before about I’m going to come out as big, as strong and fast as I’ve gone in, because I’ve got a rhythm to my life on making sure that I keep as much normality as I can. I keep hungry and smart because I want to keep achieving. But I’m going to keep the momentum because I know along this journey, opportunity’s going to present. I can guarantee the people out there, opportunities are going to present, because some people will stop and they’ll lose their rhythm. So doing that, I think it’s very important.

Billy Moore (01:31:17):

And the fourth thing, when you’re on that plane and things aren’t going well, the oxygen mask drops down. What do they tell you to do?

Ian Ugarte (01:31:25):

Put your own on first.

Billy Moore (01:31:27):

100%. Look after yourself. You must look after yourself first, because the best way to help those around you, is to be strong yourself. And by making sure you stay strong individually, then you have a chance to help someone else. But if you become weak and fragile [crosstalk 01:31:41].

Ian Ugarte (01:31:41):

But that’s the issue, oxygen mask theory is if you put on someone else’s, you’re going to be on the floor and be a detriment to everyone, and probably put everyone else in danger.

Billy Moore (01:31:47):

Yeah. Yep. Well, a financial way of looking at is, the best way to help the poor is not to become one. Because as soon as you’ve got no capacity to financially assist, then you have your handout. So has the rest of the line. So the best way to help the poor is not to become one. The best way to stay strong in here is to help yourself and then look to help those around you.

Ian Ugarte (01:32:08):

I haven’t spoken too much about this one. What’s your learns about the outdoor area for Augello’s?

Billy Moore (01:32:15):

The outdoor area, it was great. It actually is turning the business around.

Ian Ugarte (01:32:17):

The story is that you’ve got this space, everyone else along the promenade there has outdoor seating, but you don’t have outdoor seating.

Billy Moore (01:32:28):

No, we didn’t. We’ve got a lower deck, but it’s raised, it’s got a basic balcony around it. So we couldn’t just go and put a chair on the other side of it, because you’d fall down to the lower street level. We were offered from the local council to move out underneath trees within 20 meters of our front door. Now with Augello’s, 200 days a year between probably 6:00 and 7:30, we turn people away. Every Saturday, Sunday, we’ll turn people away in that zone. And we’ll say, “Please come back, there’s an opportunity to dine. Come back at 7:45, 8:00.” They don’t come back.

Billy Moore (01:33:02):

So we reached our max capacity, 110 seats. They were full for that hour or so, 200 days of the year. What this outdoor area gave us is, “Well, you can’t come inside, but if you like, you can go underneath those trees.” And al fresco, a la carte dining has really cottoned on. In Mooloolabah, if it’s nice weather, even now, it’s beautiful out there.

Billy Moore (01:33:25):

So what’s happened to us at a time when, actually our upstairs dining started to wain, this downstairs dining has picked up. And it allowed us to soak up an excess capacity.

Ian Ugarte (01:33:39):

At not much extra cost.

Billy Moore (01:33:40):

Well, virtually the area is owned by the council, so that was given to us and a very good rate, like everyone else on the strip. But it didn’t cost us any more in labor.

Ian Ugarte (01:33:51):

Still have the same staff on because [crosstalk 01:33:52] anyway.

Billy Moore (01:33:53):

And obviously the gas and electricity and the food costs, they were all about the same. So we’ve found that, by having this addition, being pragmatic and finding another opportunity inside of the business was great. What we’ve also done is, I was so [inaudible 01:34:13] at the time, to me, initially learning to be restaurateur, you’re dining between 12:00 and 2:30, shut everything down, open up then between 5:00 and 8:30, all day dying. “Oh no, you don’t want to add because you had extra overheads and all this extra staff.”

Billy Moore (01:34:28):

What we realized is, we wanted to create a vast place downstairs in the lower deck, because everyone else had this part. [inaudible 01:34:36]. Then we realized, [inaudible 01:34:39]. We used to shut at two o’clock. So all of a sudden we’ve kept it open. I think, “Hopefully we can do $1500 a week was my goal.” Bit more goal setting, my first goal was $1500 a week. We did that first week. We’re now, when we’re humming, it’s up to five, six, $7,000 a week in an area which we never used. And what we did, it didn’t cost us anything. Actually it cost us less because we sharpened up our rostering. We got pragmatic. We looked at the same thing, but from a different angle. And that’s what-

Ian Ugarte (01:35:07):

Because you used to have staff sitting around for three hours clearing [inaudible 01:35:10].

Billy Moore (01:35:10):

Yeah, yeah.

Ian Ugarte (01:35:11):

So that’s an extra 250 to 300 K in revenue that you weren’t getting before.

Billy Moore (01:35:16):

And talk about the compounding of, if you increase revenue, 10%. So that’s been brilliant. So we’re coupling up this lower bar area, tacked on the outside area. So it’s taken our business to another level.

Ian Ugarte (01:35:34):

I think the important thing everything that’s happened financially because of the virus is that internal tourism is going to be bigger than ever. And people love the Sunshine Coast.

Billy Moore (01:35:43):

The Sunshine Coast specifically and Mooloolabah especially we are not a fly market in terms of international. International guests, I reckon there’ll be less than 5%, maybe even lower. We ‘re a drive market around the Southeast and also the Downs area out at Western Queensland. I do a lot of talking out there, amazing how many times… I was speaking someplace, you go out way out west like Whitton or [inaudible 01:36:11] or something and the Augello’s restaurant “Oh yeah, we know it.” Country folk come to the Sunshine Coast.

Billy Moore (01:36:17):

So for us, if we can get the flying domestic market, and I’m sure we will, because I don’t think people will be flying away for a long time. Well I’m not afraid of it, if you’re flying in, but if we can pick up the Sydney and Melbourne fly market.

Ian Ugarte (01:36:34):

You still get a fair bit of that, because I know when we run together and I’m running with [Kerry 01:36:35] as well, I know when it’s school holidays and that’s because when we’re running along the promenade and you say hello to everyone, they don’t say hello back because they’re from Sydney or Melbourne. So you’ve sort of got that market there.

Billy Moore (01:36:49):

Yeah, we do and it’ll only get better. And what I think, what I can’t wait to see if we can take the chance, make the most of opportunities to [inaudible 00:15:56] businesses on the sunshine coast. When someone from Melbourne comes up or Sydney comes up, so they’re going, “We normally go to Hawaii or we go to the Maldives, or we normally go to the Caribbean.” To say, “Let’s go to Mooloolabah,” how good is this? This is our chance. This is our chance. I talked about opportunities, [inaudible 01:37:14] the chance, this is our chance inside your business to make the most of it. Because of the terrible circumstances, the opportunity now presents. And I agree with you. I think domestic tourism, over the next 12 months, this is our chance to capture a market that we probably haven’t been exposed to.

Ian Ugarte (01:37:29):

So, I can’t remember, we were training for something. Can’t remember what we were training for, but we had to do a 16 K run and Kerry and I, so Billy’s wife, I’m allowed to thank you for allowing me to run off with your wife. We can be at time whippets, when we’re both pretty fit, we can go. And you’re not as smooth a runner, so when you’re running with baby elephants, certainly not by stealth, because you can hear him thumping along behind you, or in front of you sometimes, because you do kick. And I remember this run that we did, we went out to the lighthouse and back. And at the lighthouse halfway was the turn, 16 K to get back. And there’s something that is inbred in people to be able to dig deep and pull it out.

Ian Ugarte (01:38:22):

And I was just so awesome, I was like awestruck in the ability for you, because you weren’t fit, anywhere near as fit as us two, and you just dug striped down deep. And I watched you, I watched the whole persona of you running up the hill, up the Mooloolabah Hill down into Alex. And I was just, “Holy fuck, that is some guts that pulled out.” And these are the things that I love to watch. People say, why do you do what you do? Because every day I get out of bed, I want to see someone change. I want to see someone challenge what they do and you do that consistently. But that day sticks so hard for me because I watched how much pain you were in and how much you pushed through it just to get to the back end.

Billy Moore (01:39:08):

Yeah. I’ve seen you push through pain a fair few times too actually. Unfortunately, now I’ve got to get a hip replacement. So that was one thing. But the pain that I pushed through came at a cost, but I wouldn’t change one thing.

Billy Moore (01:39:21):

Little quick one for the listeners. My doctor’s going to do the surgery, obviously at the moment surgeries are off. I went and saw him to have this thing called a resurfacing where they basically almost detach the leg, put a cap on the top of the femur and then a reciprocal into the pelvic girdle. It’s good because I can still run. To chop off [inaudible 01:39:40], I don’t want that because you can’t run again.

Billy Moore (01:39:42):

So I went and saw the surgeon, Associate Professor [Patrick Winebrow 01:39:47], and I walked in, he goes, “Oh, I thought it was going to be you.” He said, “I can’t wait to show you these photos.” I was taken aback, I was with [inaudible 01:39:54]. “I’ve got some great photos, great photos. I said, “Yeah, good, but can we talk about the hip?” He goes, “Oh yeah.” So he takes me through the procedure. He said, “You’re a perfect candidate. 48, you can keep running.” Because I’ve got four marathons I’m going to do, so I can’t stop running. I’m going to do these four marathons-

Ian Ugarte (01:40:08):

Remember we’re only starting with one. We’re only going to do one.

Billy Moore (01:40:14):

I’ve got four to go. So anyway, I got into the meeting or consultation, I said, “So what are these photos?” And I’ll have to send the photos to you, so you can send them to our viewers. He’s obsessive compulsive this guy. He was going to go climb Mount Everest, but he can’t because obviously in Nepal they shut the business down earlier on. But he wasn’t happy with the surgical equipment he used. So he goes, “I made my own.” So he sent them off to the manufacturer and the manufacturer came back and said, “They’re brilliant.” And they said, “We’ll make them, and you can name them.” That’s normal procedure, if you invent the [inaudible 01:40:51], you get to name them the way you want.” [inaudible 01:40:53] normally name them. I said, “Well, after themselves.” He goes, “Oh [inaudible 01:40:56] I don’t want to do that.”

Billy Moore (01:40:57):

He goes, “I want to name them after something that I, and the other doctors from the Gold Coast and all these staff who had a buy-in to inventing the instruments or creating them, something they all believe in.” And I said, “What’d you call them?” He showed me a photo of a surgery where he’s behind the plastic mask and his gown, there’s blood everywhere, and there’s someone’s legs over there. And all these instruments, the knives, the axes and the saws were all called Queensland.

Billy Moore (01:41:25):

I said, I want the surgery done. And I said, “I’m going to get two jerseys, I’ll give you the jersey, I’ll sign them both.” I said, “I want my knives and saws you use with the blood left on.”

Ian Ugarte (01:41:37):

So you can put them on the Jersey.

Billy Moore (01:41:38):

I’m going to frame them.

Ian Ugarte (01:41:38):

Oh, how awesome.

Billy Moore (01:41:42):

So the Queensland [inaudible 01:41:41].

Ian Ugarte (01:41:43):

What I like about you is that you take context in everything. And they’ve already seen it and they haven’t picked it up already, Craig Bellamy does the three things. Everything that you do is either three or four things. Everything we ever talk about is, the first thing I say is this. And the second is this, and the third is this. And sometimes you throw the fourth one in.

Billy Moore (01:41:59):

Yeah. It sounds a simple model, but I talked about rhythm and momentum. And if you can create a rhythm of constantly achieving, constantly passing goals, constantly setting something to better, you’re getting in front of those guideposts, you’re creating a rhythm. That creates momentum and momentum is how you make change.

Billy Moore (01:42:21):

Because change to me has to be done over a sustained period of time. And real success, whether it be an individual or organization, comes through sustained momentum and the three KPIs. Each day you get up and you go, “I know I’m going to do this, this and this.” Or you sit up the night before and you go, “Okay, what’s the most important thing for me to achieve tomorrow or next week.” You itemize it, you write it down, you’re making a contract with yourself. You can’t deny you’ve done it. You’ve written down areas, and you go out and you tick, tick, tick. [inaudible 01:42:54], what’s next, what’s next, what’s next day.

Billy Moore (01:42:56):

And what you’ll find is you constantly, the moment it happens, happens, and then all of a sudden you’ll start to achieve those long-term goals. You want that long-term development to happen. Well, along the way, let’s break that up. Let’s get into momentum. What are we going to do today? How are we going to do something today that’s going to fix something all the way down there.

Ian Ugarte (01:43:14):

You talk about, even at nighttime, at nighttime, you’ve got a goal. And your goal is that shining light. You’re going driving to that town, you can see the light in the distance, but you don’t know what the road looks like. And then you talk about guideposts along the way.

Billy Moore (01:43:24):

And I talk about passing them. So here are the guideposts, you can see them. You can see the goal, one goal, two… And the short-term goals you set each day. And they’ve got to be realistic because there’s no point setting goal two if it’s around the corner, over the hill, you can’t see it. So it’s got to be at a measurable distance in front. “I can see where I want to get to today, I’m going to go and get that.” Because once I get two, I get three.

Billy Moore (01:43:46):

Because the thing about guideposts, how often do you look at the guideposts in the mirror when you go past them.

Ian Ugarte (01:43:49):


Billy Moore (01:43:52):

I don’t. Once you get past the goal, when I played first grade at 17 years and 10 months, that goal at 23 wiped out and I just had another one. So you’ve got to keep goals out in front, keep them off into the distance and keep challenges off. But while we’re on that road to success, what I will always love to go back to people, and this is the learns. On that road, you are going to have the broken jaw moment. At some point of that road, every row has a crossroad, guaranteed. Guaranteed that that’s what will happen, that’s one of the things that’s certainty in life.

Billy Moore (01:44:23):

It’s when you come to the crossroad, what do you do? And the key fundamental there is [inaudible 01:44:29] we need that crossroad, that is the fundamental. What or how else [inaudible 01:44:36]? How bad did you want this goal? How bad did you want this outcome? How bad did you want to succeed? Because right now’s going to be your test. That’s the great thing about adversity.

Billy Moore (01:44:48):

As Pat Jarvis said, it’s right now, the darkest moment right before the dawn. The broken jawbone. You don’t deserve it, you’ve got to make it and take it. So right now is how much at that crossroad do you want that successful road to continue on? And that’s when you ask yourself the question, Do I want to give up. Do I really want it? Because if it was easy, if the development was easy, everyone would have it. Everyone would have done it.

Ian Ugarte (01:45:12):


Billy Moore (01:45:13):

So that’s what differentiates average from good, good to great is being able… And it’s not big, special, magical things. It’s those little 1%ers, those little fundamentals getting them right. And when you hit that crossroad, “I’m not going to run from this challenge. I want this, this bad, I’m actually going to take this challenge on because I’ve got confidence in the honesty I’ve built my goals around.”

Ian Ugarte (01:45:36):

Amazing, Billy Moore, thank you very much.

Billy Moore (01:45:42):

Thank you. And our wonderful listeners. Hopefully you got something from that. I always say on the back of it, I’ve thrown as much information as I can, but one fundamental, don’t do restaurants. Stay out of the restaurant game, that’s for fools like me.

Ian Ugarte (01:45:52):

Okay, awesome.

Ian Ugarte (01:45:53):

Thanks for hanging around with Small Talk, Big Ideas podcast. We hope you enjoyed that and pulled out plenty of information that’ll help you move forward. If you want to find out or listen to more podcasts, please subscribe, follow us on social media or go to to find out much more about what we do. And we’ll see you next time.

Announcer (01:46:14):

Thanks for tuning in to the Small Talk, Big Ideas podcast. We hope we’ve succeeded in our goal to inspire and challenge you. And we look forward to catching you on the next episode of Small Talk, Big Ideas with Ian Ugarte.

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